Date   
Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

hanspeter baettig
 

Hi Danny
amazing
3200 sm in 17 days; means 188 sm per day
and 3 day with no wind.
You sail realy a Super Maramu or a racing cat ?
tell us the story
greetings
Hanspeter
SM 16 , Tamango 2
Sardinia, Palau

Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Am 26.07.2017 um 20:58 schrieb Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>:

 

Hi Pat,

I wont tell Kent about the stowaway. If you take off the three windless days the miles covered in the other 14 days easily tops 200. Not many classes can match that. A big part of it is the ability to go through the night under full sail because it is so easy to reduce sail without leaving the security of the cockpit. Most cruisers in other designs sensibly reduce sail at nightfall.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 27 July 2017 at 00:21 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Danny , That is a great ave. run about 190 . Kent drove up a couple of weeks ago and had dinner with us and discussed his plans. Don't tell him, but I plan to stow away  in his aft lazarett e . My understanding is that when you turn the key , it closes a solenoid that connects the neg. side to the starter solenoid. I would like to know where it is , as it could be could fail someday. If my understanding is incorrect , I would appreciate it if someone would tell me I am mistaken . This would be on a Volvo TMD 22A.

Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 12:05 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
sorry you wont make NZ by sail, its a great voyage across the Pacific. Some great down wind sailing in big Pacific swells. We did 3200 miles in 17 days and had three days with no wind. These SM have long legs. I think Kent is building up a head of steam to do it.
Sorry, cant give you the solenoid position. I would do a wire trace starting with the battery terminals and working through.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 13:02 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny , Yea email is great .Diane and I would love to see you guys again, I thought it would happen under sail one day , but with four grandchildren in the last two years , it may have to be under wings. I love N.Z. and want to revisit it someday. Do you know where the negative solenoid is located , I want to check the contacts , although that would not explain the Gen. set not starting. 
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 7:09 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
That's the good side of problems, it gets us on to the forum to renew friendships. Great to maintain contact from so far away.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 09:38 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny, The intermittent starting problem I have had for months. The engine would do nothing or it would start right up normally. I switched out batteries , no jumper . I think it is most likely to be a poor connection somewhere and probably on the negative side. Thats where I will start , going out to the boat now to get started . Good to hear from you , say Hi ! to Yvonne .
Thanks,< /span>
Pat SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]  0;amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 3:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
I spin through the posts deleting after read but I believe you said the motors start sometimes, sometimes not. When they start do they spin as per normal or groan. Batteries dont fail and then not fail. You've tried another battery with n o change which gives a pretty positive lead to it not being battery.  Was that by jumper lead or by switching via terminals? The symptoms sound like a bad connection. Not the starting switch because there are separate for each engine. It has to be a common connection. Battery terminals a good starting point
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 04:36 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I switched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.

< /span>
Thanks,
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Ame l Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Pat,
 
Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, Jul y 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the generator the glow plug doesn't light up.
< div class="ox-a770aa1e71-aolmail_ox-dc7bb36eea-aolmail_ox-939b5ba8cb-aolmail_ox-fbd1f879e3-aolmail_MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">Thanks ,Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@...< /a> [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtown ers <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the generator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
 
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making go od contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause the symptoms of OK voltage without load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.   ;
 
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batt ery.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
 
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my s tarting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
 
  Regards,  John
 
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC


---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue within five days. B elow is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will st art.
Battery shows 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at battery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /d iv>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite does not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
 
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understand ing is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Bot h engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
< /div>
 
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem would be appreciated.
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 

 


 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] shaft seal for Calpeda AC puimp

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Eric,

Have you checked with info"at"cooastalclimatecontrol.com? They used to stock these.

All I can tell you is that it is a 12mm mechanical seal.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550





On Wed, Jul 26, 2017 at 4:58 PM, 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Hi,

I need to buy a spare shaft seal on the Calpeda pump that is for my AC units.

I am repairing another pump and found a source for Metric shaft seals , I thought I would, at the same time, buy a spare for the Calpeda AC pump.

Can someone email me a photo and measurements of the seal and the seat?

There seems to be many configurations of this seat and 4 different seat materials such as graphite , ceramic and a few others.

I can then order it at the same time.

Fair Winds Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

Kimberlite@...._,___


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Removing red battery switch handles

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Pat,

I have done it, but have forgotten. On #387 the removal was very straightforward. I also unscrewed the switches and was able to clean the connections and coat them with corrosionX. I think there was a pin through the plastic.

Of course, it is possible that the switches were changed during the production of the SM.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

On Wed, Jul 26, 2017 at 4:57 PM, sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

I asked this question under a different thread and it may have gotten lost. I need to remove the battery switches to access the wires and switches for cleaning . Can anyone tell me how to remove the red handles ? It is impossible to look into the small holes to see what is in there . Also, are the switches sealed or can they be opened to inspect them ?


Thanks,

Pat SM #123


shaft seal for Calpeda AC puimp

eric freedman
 

Hi,

I need to buy a spare shaft seal on the Calpeda pump that is for my AC units.

I am repairing another pump and found a source for Metric shaft seals , I thought I would, at the same time, buy a spare for the Calpeda AC pump.

Can someone email me a photo and measurements of the seal and the seat?

There seems to be many configurations of this seat and 4 different seat materials such as graphite , ceramic and a few others.

I can then order it at the same time.

Fair Winds Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

Kimberlite@...._,___

Removing red battery switch handles

Patrick McAneny
 

I asked this question under a different thread and it may have gotten lost. I need to remove the battery switches to access the wires and switches for cleaning . Can anyone tell me how to remove the red handles ? It is impossible to look into the small holes to see what is in there . Also, are the switches sealed or can they be opened to inspect them ?


Thanks,

Pat SM #123

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Amel propeller

Chris Shiels <rettirc@...>
 

Hi Kent,

Previously you mentioned above having a propeller you may be interested in selling, would you happen to have the number on the blades and more importantly the hat sort of price would be appropriate?   

Could you please private message me   Rettirc at gmail . Com
If anyone else has a Autoprop the might be interested to sell, please let me know. 

We shall be on the boat for the first time within the week, oh so much to do!!

Chris Shiels
Sm224

On 24 Jun 2017, at 10:31 PM, Kent Robertsonme karkauai@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Chris,
Yes, I still have it, and yes, I will sell it to you.  It needs servicing (routine maintenance).

What engine do you have?

Congratulations on your new SM!

Please contact me at 
karkauai "at" yahoo "dot" com
Or text/call at 828-234-6819

Kent Robertson
S/V Kristy
SM243

On Jun 23, 2017, at 9:01 PM, Chris Shiels rettirc@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Kent,

I have been searching through the forum about propellers and saw a recent post that you made regarding the Auto Prop.

The vessel (SM224) which we are in contract to purchase next month only has a fixed pitch prop and saw that you have/had a Auto Prop available for purchase, would you still have this?

If you still have it, are you still willing to sell it?

We are super excited about the boat, we are moving on late July as a family, we have a work list a mile long but I love a challenge

Still can't believe we are getting a Super Maramu!!!

Chris Shiels
+61 424521357

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Pat.
We did motor a bit but not much as it was early in the crossing and we didn't want to use up diesel in case of a disastrous emergency. When you will at some stage be 1600 miles from the nearest land fuel conservation is sensible. We were still making 3 to 4 knots under sail some of the time, less at others.
Regards
Danny

Sent from my Vodafone Smart

On 27 Jul 2017 08:39, "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Danny, That's a deal . I assumed you may have motored those days to keep up . 200 miles days are the golden ring. Diane and I avg. about 180 /day from BVI to Bermuda and I was more than pleased with that. That's flyin !

Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 2:58 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
Hi Pat,
I wont tell Kent about the stowaway. If you take off the three windless days the miles covered in the other 14 days easily tops 200. Not many classes can match that. A big part of it is the ability to go through the night under full sail because it is so easy to reduce sail without leaving the security of the cockpit. Most cruisers in other designs sensibly reduce sail at nightfall.
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 27 July 2017 at 00:21 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny , That is a great ave. run about 190 . Kent drove up a couple of weeks ago and had dinner with us and discussed his plans. Don't tell him, but I plan to stow away  in his aft lazarette . My understanding is that when you turn the key , it closes a solenoid that connects the neg. side to the starter solenoid. I would like to know where it is , as it could be could fail someday. If my understanding is incorrect , I would appreciate it if someone would tell me I am mistaken . This would be on a Volvo TMD 22A.
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 12:05 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
sorry you wont make NZ by sail, its a great voyage across the Pacific. Some great down wind sailing in big Pacific swells. We did 3200 miles in 17 days and had three days with no wind. These SM have long legs. I think Kent is building up a head of steam to do it.
Sorry, cant give you the solenoid position. I would do a wire trace starting with the battery terminals and working through.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 13:02 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny , Yea email is great .Diane and I would love to see you guys again, I thought it would happen under sail one day , but with four grandchildren in the last two years , it may have to be under wings. I love N.Z. and want to revisit it someday. Do you know where the negative solenoid is located , I want to check the contacts , although that would not explain the Gen. set not starting. 
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amely achtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 7:09 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
That's the good side of problems, it gets us on to the forum to renew friendships. Great to maintain contact from so far away.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 09:38 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowner s]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny, The intermittent starting problem I have had for months. The engine would do nothing or it would start right up normally. I switched out batteries , no jumper . I think it is most likely to be a poor connection somewhere and probably on the negative side. Thats where I will start , going out to the boat now to get started . Good to hear from you , say Hi ! to Yvonne .
Thanks,< /span>
Pat SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 3:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
I spin through the posts deleting after read but I believe you said the motors start sometimes, sometimes not. When they s tart do they spin as per normal or groan. Batteries dont fail and then not fail. You've tried another battery with n o change which gives a pretty positive lead to it not being battery.  Was that by jumper lead or by switching via terminals? The symptoms sound like a bad connection. Not the starting switch because there are separate for each engine. It has to be a common connection. Battery terminals a good starting point
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 04:36 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I switched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.

Thanks,
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Ame l Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Pat,
 
Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogro ups.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the gen erator the glow plug doesn't light up.
Thanks ,Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@...< /a> [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtown ers <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the ge nerator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
 
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making go od contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause th e symptoms of OK voltage without load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.   ;
 
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batt ery.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
 
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my starting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
 
  Regards,  John
 
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC


---In amelyachtowne rs@..., <sailw32@...> wrote :
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue w ithin five days. B elow is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will st art.
Battery shows 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at b attery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /d iv>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite doe s not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
 
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understand ing is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Both engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
< /div>
 
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem would be appreciated.
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Patrick McAneny
 

Danny, That's a deal . I assumed you may have motored those days to keep up . 200 miles days are the golden ring. Diane and I avg. about 180 /day from BVI to Bermuda and I was more than pleased with that. That's flyin !
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 2:58 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
Hi Pat,
I wont tell Kent about the stowaway. If you take off the three windless days the miles covered in the other 14 days easily tops 200. Not many classes can match that. A big part of it is the ability to go through the night under full sail because it is so easy to reduce sail without leaving the security of the cockpit. Most cruisers in other designs sensibly reduce sail at nightfall.
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 27 July 2017 at 00:21 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny , That is a great ave. run about 190 . Kent drove up a couple of weeks ago and had dinner with us and discussed his plans. Don't tell him, but I plan to stow away  in his aft lazarette . My understanding is that when you turn the key , it closes a solenoid that connects the neg. side to the starter solenoid. I would like to know where it is , as it could be could fail someday. If my understanding is incorrect , I would appreciate it if someone would tell me I am mistaken . This would be on a Volvo TMD 22A.
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 12:05 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
sorry you wont make NZ by sail, its a great voyage across the Pacific. Some great down wind sailing in big Pacific swells. We did 3200 miles in 17 days and had three days with no wind. These SM have long legs. I think Kent is building up a head of steam to do it.
Sorry, cant give you the solenoid position. I would do a wire trace starting with the battery terminals and working through.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 13:02 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny , Yea email is great .Diane and I would love to see you guys again, I thought it would happen under sail one day , but with four grandchildren in the last two years , it may have to be under wings. I love N.Z. and want to revisit it someday. Do you know where the negative solenoid is located , I want to check the contacts , although that would not explain the Gen. set not starting. 
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amely achtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 7:09 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
That's the good side of problems, it gets us on to the forum to renew friendships. Great to maintain contact from so far away.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 09:38 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowner s]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny, The intermittent starting problem I have had for months. The engine would do nothing or it would start right up normally. I switched out batteries , no jumper . I think it is most likely to be a poor connection somewhere and probably on the negative side. Thats where I will start , going out to the boat now to get started . Good to hear from you , say Hi ! to Yvonne .
Thanks,< /span>
Pat SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 3:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
I spin through the posts deleting after read but I believe you said the motors start sometimes, sometimes not. When they s tart do they spin as per normal or groan. Batteries dont fail and then not fail. You've tried another battery with n o change which gives a pretty positive lead to it not being battery.  Was that by jumper lead or by switching via terminals? The symptoms sound like a bad connection. Not the starting switch because there are separate for each engine. It has to be a common connection. Battery terminals a good starting point
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 04:36 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I switched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.

Thanks,
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Ame l Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Pat,
 
Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@yahoogro ups.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the gen erator the glow plug doesn't light up.
Thanks ,Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@...< /a> [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtown ers <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the ge nerator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
 
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making go od contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause th e symptoms of OK voltage without load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.   ;
 
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batt ery.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
 
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my starting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
 
  Regards,  John
 
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC


---In amelyachtowne rs@..., wrote :
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue w ithin five days. B elow is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will st art.
Battery shows 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at b attery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /d iv>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite doe s not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
 
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understand ing is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Both engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
< /div>
 
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem would be appreciated.
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] St Michaels Amel Rendezvous July 30 Aug 5

Craig & Katherine Briggs SN 68 Sangaris Tropic Isle Harbor, FL
 


HI Ric,
Per Subject. July 30 Aug 5.  Nothing formal, just that we'll be around St Michaels for roughly that time.
Cheers, Craig

---In amelyachtowners@..., <ric@...> wrote :

Do you have a date?

Ric

Bali Hai SN24

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 8:45 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] St Michaels Amel Rendezvous July 30 Aug 5


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Pat,

I wont tell Kent about the stowaway. If you take off the three windless days the miles covered in the other 14 days easily tops 200. Not many classes can match that. A big part of it is the ability to go through the night under full sail because it is so easy to reduce sail without leaving the security of the cockpit. Most cruisers in other designs sensibly reduce sail at nightfall.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 27 July 2017 at 00:21 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Danny , That is a great ave. run about 190 . Kent drove up a couple of weeks ago and had dinner with us and discussed his plans. Don't tell him, but I plan to stow away  in his aft lazarette . My understanding is that when you turn the key , it closes a solenoid that connects the neg. side to the starter solenoid. I would like to know where it is , as it could be could fail someday. If my understanding is incorrect , I would appreciate it if someone would tell me I am mistaken . This would be on a Volvo TMD 22A.

Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 12:05 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
sorry you wont make NZ by sail, its a great voyage across the Pacific. Some great down wind sailing in big Pacific swells. We did 3200 miles in 17 days and had three days with no wind. These SM have long legs. I think Kent is building up a head of steam to do it.
Sorry, cant give you the solenoid position. I would do a wire trace starting with the battery terminals and working through.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 13:02 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny , Yea email is great .Diane and I would love to see you guys again, I thought it would happen under sail one day , but with four grandchildren in the last two years , it may have to be under wings. I love N.Z. and want to revisit it someday. Do you know where the negative solenoid is located , I want to check the contacts , although that would not explain the Gen. set not starting. 
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 7:09 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
That's the good side of problems, it gets us on to the forum to renew friendships. Great to maintain contact from so far away.
Regards
Danny
On 26 July 2017 at 09:38 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny, The intermittent starting problem I have had for months. The engine would do nothing or it would start right up normally. I switched out batteries , no jumper . I think it is most likely to be a poor connection somewhere and probably on the negative side. Thats where I will start , going out to the boat now to get started . Good to hear from you , say Hi ! to Yvonne .
Thanks,< /span>
Pat SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 3:48 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Pat,
I spin through the posts deleting after read but I believe you said the motors start sometimes, sometimes not. When they start do they spin as per normal or groan. Batteries dont fail and then not fail. You've tried another battery with n o change which gives a pretty positive lead to it not being battery.  Was that by jumper lead or by switching via terminals? The symptoms sound like a bad connection. Not the starting switch because there are separate for each engine. It has to be a common connection. Battery terminals a good starting point
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 04:36 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I switched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.

Thanks,
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Ame l Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Pat,
 
Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
 
 
With best regards,
 
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the generator the glow plug doesn't light up.
Thanks ,Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@...< /a> [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtown ers <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the generator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
 
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making go od contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause the symptoms of OK voltage without load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.   ;
 
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batt ery.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
 
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my starting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
 
  Regards,  John
 
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC


---In amelyachtowners@..., <sailw32@...> wrote :
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue within five days. B elow is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will st art.
Battery shows 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at battery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /d iv>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite does not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
 
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understand ing is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Both engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
< /div>
 
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem would be appreciated.
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 
 

 


 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Yes Alan,

not an Amel set up, a previous owner put them in. I like it. More room for house bank, shorter cable run to the starters and starter battery redundancy. All good

Regards

Danny

On 26 July 2017 at 23:54 "divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Danny

That's pretty unusual I think.
Most SMs have one start battery at the fwd end of the house bank under the sea berth which starts both the engine and the genset.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437

 


 

Re: st michaels amel rendezvous july 30 aug 5

Gary Wells
 

Dang!!! Our flight leaves on the 31st :(. We are just across the Bay in Deale (sans boat) but will need to be in D.C. either Sunday night or early Monday morning.
Timing is everything :)

Gary W
S/V Adagio, SM 209

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] St Michaels Amel Rendezvous July 30 Aug 5

Mike Ondra
 

If Fri or Sat Aug 4/5 Aletes may be able to be there.
Mike Ondra
Aletes SM#240
Rock Hall, MD

Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid

On Jul 26, 2017 11:16 AM, "Mcgovern.denise@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Mark and Denise are just on the other side of the Chesapeake.  If we narrow the time down we can join in.


Denise
s/v Cara
SM #440
Deale, MD

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] St Michaels Amel Rendezvous July 30 Aug 5

Denise McGovern
 

Mark and Denise are just on the other side of the Chesapeake.  If we narrow the time down we can join in.

Denise
s/v Cara
SM #440
Deale, MD

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] St Michaels Amel Rendezvous July 30 Aug 5

Ric Gottschalk <ric@...>
 

Do you have a date?

Ric

Bali Hai SN24

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 8:45 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] St Michaels Amel Rendezvous July 30 Aug 5

 

 

What do you have when two Amels are in sight of each other - no, not a race but a rendezvous. So Kent on Kristy and Craig&Katherine on Sangaris will  be in St. Michael's MD, USA for the week (or more).  Log canoe races will be going on, raft ups, shore-side sailing pals and good fun.  If you're anywhere near join in the camaraderie. 

Cheers,

Craig and Katherine Briggs on SN68 SANGARIS, anchored off Reedville, VA en route to St. Michael's

Re: Selecting the proper Genoa for a Super Maramu

karkauai
 

When I bought Kristy (SM243) she had no sails.  I got talked into a 135genoa of dacron with spectra reinforcement, sorry I don't know the weight.  This sail works with the 155 that came with the boat as a double head sail rig.  However, in light air I would like to have the 155, and there's more often light air than too much air.
I also have a 110 Yankee cut genoa that I use when winds are expected to be consistently above 15-20 kts.  It's a great sail for those conditions.  It's made of the same dacron/spectra material as the 135.

Get the 155, and add a 110...you won't regret it.

Kent

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Patrick McAneny
 

Eric , That is what logic would dictate , so I am concentrating on the switches , as to wires split there going to both engines. 
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Message-----
From: 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 3:49 am
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
Hi Pat,
When I made mention of the negative circuit on the engine I did not know you had the same problem with the genset.
I would check the battery first and then everything going to the genset and engine. At some point the wires split to go to either the genset or the engine. The problem could be at the junction or anywhere between that point and the battery.
Fair Winds
Eric
Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376
 
 
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:36 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I sw itched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.
 
Thanks,
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelya chtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Pat,
 
Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
 
 
With best regards,
&nb sp;
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the generator the glow plug doesn't light up.
Thanks ,Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the generator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
 
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making good contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause the symptoms of OK voltage wit hout load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.  
 
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batter y.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
 
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my starting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
 
  Regards,  John
 
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue within five days. Below is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will start.
Battery sho ws 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at battery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /div>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite does not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
 
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understanding is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Both engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
 
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem woul d be appreciated.
 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Patrick McAneny
 

Eric, That is what logic would dictate , so I am concertrating 


-----Original Message-----
From: 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 3:49 am
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
Hi Pat,
When I made mention of the negative circuit on the engine I did not know you had the same problem with the genset.
I would check the battery first and then everything going to the genset and engine. At some point the wires split to go to either the genset or the engine. The problem could be at the junction or anywhere between that point and the battery.
Fair Winds
Eric
Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376
 
 
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:36 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to do for a long time. I sw itched out batteries to eliminate it being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is , there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know, answer , very little.
 
Thanks,
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners] <amelya chtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Pat,
 
Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the battery has enough oomph left in it.
 
 
With best regards,
&nb sp;
Mark
 
Skipper
Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
Currently cruising - Grenada
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 10:00 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
 
John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button buzz. On the generator the glow plug doesn't light up.
Thanks ,Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: john.biohead@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
 
Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one common starting battery for both the generator and motor.
  Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a couple of thoughts:
 
1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is not making good contact.  I assume you are speaking of the battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at the helm.    A high resistance connection could cause the symptoms of OK voltage wit hout load,  but when you try to start there  is not enough current to do anything.  
 
2. If the battery is failing it might be able to show OK voltage but not have capacity to start the engines.  When you said after attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8,  was that while starting or after the attempts are completed?   
 
 If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a lot of drain on the batter y.  That 11.8 after an attempt would then point me toward a bad battery.  But you already tried a different battery.  Are you sure all the batteries tried are good and properly charged?  
 
I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take a look at my starting circuit and let you know if I see anything that makes sense for these symptoms.
 
  Regards,  John
 
John Clark
SV Annie SM 37
Charleston SC
For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental or not. Last night we went out to go for a sail and the eng ine would not start and I discovered that the generator would not start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking forward to it and so need to solve this issue within five days. Below is what I determined last night ;
Neither engine will start.
Battery sho ws 12.6 V
Have 12.6 V at both solenoids   
Have 12.6 V at battery wires on back side of battery switches
When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start and fan and gauges go dead.
After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm button pushed , nothing
I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things happen< /div>
Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires , don't know which does what.
The glow plug lite does not even come on.
fuse is good on back side of Gen.
Solenoids don't click
Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
 
It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is affecting both engines 
My understanding is that when the key is turned , the ground is momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
Both engines would not share this switch , would they.
Do both engines share the same ground?
To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on the back of the battery switches between the positive and negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids 
 
Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem woul d be appreciated.
 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

Patrick McAneny
 

Danny , I do have a different set up . One starter battery shared with both engines , installed next to the house batteries. I plan to bypass the switch today and see if its the switch . Problem is that I can't access the neg. wires below the positive switch , without removing the positive switch and I can't get the red handle off , just to tight to take off and clean all the heavy wires on the neg. side.
Thanks,
Pat



-----Original Message-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Wed, Jul 26, 2017 12:38 am
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
Hi Pat. I think Ocean Pearl is set up differently. She has two starting batteries in the engine room, one each for the gen set and main engine. There are switches for each and a connecting switch to join them. great if one battery fails. If I suspected a faulty switch I would remove the wires and by pass it to do a test. Take off the input and output wires on the switch and connect them would do it because that is what the switch does. The switch would be a suspect as there is a lot of current going through it and could have damaged the contacts in the switch, or the terminals the wires connect to..
With battery terminals don't be fooled by them looking clean. A good rub with a bit of 80 grit sandpaper on the terminals and on the inside of the connector is good. I'm sure you know all this.
Regards
Danny
SM 299 Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 13:15 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Danny, Your correct , it does rule out a lot . What does it leave , that is in common to both. The positive out of the battery switch disconnect and the negative out of the battery switch disconnect . Confirming good battery state . Can anyone think of anything else common to both engines ? Another Question , tonight I tried to remove the red handle on the battery switch , there is a small hole like for a set screw , you cannot see into the hole , I tried every allen wrench , none seemed to fit . Does anyone know how to remove the red handles ?
Thanks,
Pat


-----Original Messa ge-----
From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 7:37 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting

 
 
Hi Eric, I think this should be addressed to Pat though. I believe it is both the gen set and main engine not starting so that is likely to rule out starter motor connections, solenoids etc. Unless by some fluke they all are out on both engines. Possible but unlikely. It goes back to being some connection common to both circuits. That rules out a lot.
Regards
Danny
SM 299
Ocean Pearl
On 26 July 2017 at 09:44 "kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
 
Danny,
I would have someone turn the key and feel if the Valeo solenoid closes.
If it does I would check the engine start solenoid probably near  the Valeo solenoid.
You could also have a bad connection in the Yanmar  wiring .
You could also have a bad starter switch.
All of this can be checked with a voltmeter.
Good luck with this, I had the same problem and wound up rewiring the entire engine.
My boat is a more curr ent than yours so I am only speaking of my boat with a Yanmar .
Fair Winds
Eric
SM 376

----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners]"
Date: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 5:38 pm
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
To: amelyachtowners@...

> Danny, The intermittent starting problem I have had for months.
> The engine would do nothing or it would start right up normally.
> I switched out batteries , no jumper . I think it is most likely
> to be a poor connection somewhere and probably on the negative
> side. Thats where I will start , going out to the boat now to
> get started. Good to hear from you , say Hi ! to Yvonne .
> Thanks,
> Pat SM#123
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Danny and Yvonne SIMMS simms@... [amelyachtowners]
> To: amelyachtowners 
> Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 3:48 pm
> Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Pat,
> I spin through the posts deleting after read but I believe you
> said the motors start sometimes, sometimes not. When they start
> do they spin as per normal or groan. Batteries dont fail and
> then not fail. You've tried another battery with no change which
> gives a pretty positive lead to it not being battery. Was that
> by jumper lead or by switching via terminals? The symptoms sound
> like a bad conne ction. Not the starting switch because there are
> separate for each engine. It has to be a common connection.
> Battery terminals a good starting point
> Regards
> Danny
> SM 299 Ocean Pearl
>
> On 26 July 2017 at 04:36 "Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@...
> [amelyachtowners]" wrote:
>
>
> Mark, I ordered a load tester today, something I have meant to
> do for a long time. I switched out batteries to eliminate it
> being the battery , but who knows , maybe with my luck , both
> are bad. I hope so , but that would be too easy. The thing is ,
> there doesn't seem to be enough power to excite the gauges or
> the alarm buzzer or the glow plug light. Seems like a bad
> connection on the neg. side somewhere, but what do I know,
> answer , very little.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Pat
>
>
>
& #62; -----Original Message-----
> From: 'Mark Erdos' mcerdos@... [amelyachtowners]
> To: amelyachtowners
> Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am
> Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Pat,
>
> Test the battery with a load tester. If you do not have a load
> tester you can take the battery to any automotive parts store
> for testing. Measuring the voltage will not tell you if the
> battery has enough oomph left in it.
>
>
>
> With best regards,
>
> Mark
>
> Skipper
> Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275
> Currently cruising - Grenada
> www.creampuff.us
>
>
>
> From: amelyachtowners@...
> [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 201 7 10:00 AM
> To: amelyachtowners@...
> Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
>
>
>
>
>
> John,The 11.8v was after turning the key in an attempt to start
> , but nothing happens not even a click from the solenoid . I
> can't understand what would bleed off the voltage , nothing is
> hot to the touch. Even the gauges don't move or alarm button
> buzz. On the generator the glow plug doesn't light up.
>
> Thanks ,Pat
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: john.bioh ead@... [amelyachtowners]
> To: amelyachtowners
> Sent: Tue, Jul 25, 2017 9:29 am
> Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Engines not starting
>
>
>
>
> Not sure which model you have but on my SM 37 there is one
> common starting battery for both the generat or and motor.
>
> Reaching back to my days tinkering with old cars I have a
> couple of thoughts:
>
>
>
> 1. wiggling a switch then things work sounds like the switch is
> not making good contact. I assume you are speaking of the
> battery disconnect switch, not the ignition/starter switch at
> the helm. A high resistance connection could cause the
> symptoms of OK voltage without load, but when you try to start
> there is not enough current to do anything. ;
>
>
>
> 2. If the battery is failing it m ight be able to show OK voltage
> but not have capacity to start the engines. When you said after
> attempting to start the voltage measures 11.8, was that while
> starting or after the attempts are completed?
>
>
>
> If the starter motors don't fire there shouldn't have been a
> lot of drain on the battery. That 11.8 after an attempt would
> then point me toward a bad battery. But you already tried a
> different battery. Are you sure all the batteries tried are
> good and properly charged?
>
>
>
> I am doing some work in the engine room later today, I will take
> a look at my starting circuit and let you know if I see anything
> that makes sense for these symptoms.
>
>
>
> Regards, John
>
>
>
> John Clark
>
> SV Annie SM 37
&# 62;
> Charleston SC
>
>
>
> ---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :
>
> For some time I have had an intermittent probably starting my
> Volvo engine , I would turn the battery switch on and off a few
> times and it would start . I don't know if that was coincidental
> or not. Last night we went ou t to go for a sail and the eng ine
> would not start and I discovered that the generator would not
> start either. I would trouble shoot this more myself , but a
> year ago and reconfirmed a week ago , I agreed to take an
> elderly couple and their family out on my boat for a sunset sail
> to celebrate their 50 th Anniversary , they are really looking
> forward to it and so need to solve this issue within five days.
> Below is what I determined last night ;
> > Neither engine will start.
>
> Battery shows 12.6 V
>
> Have 12.6 V at both solenoids
>
> Have 12.6 V at battery wires on back side of battery switches
>
> When I turn the key , the fan comes on , turn the key to start
> and fan and gauges go dead.
>
> After that Voltage only measures 11. 8
>
> After short time , turn key and fan runs very slowly
>
> Turn key again , fan does not run , gauges dead , even alarm
> button pushed , nothing
>
> I switched wires to another 12v house battery , same things
> happen< /div>
>
> Generator switch has 12.6 V at the terminals , five white wires
> , don't know which does what.
>
> The glow plug lite does not even come on.
>
> fuse is good on back side of Gen.
>
> Solenoids don' t click
>
> Since battery voltage went down after key is turned a few times
> , I checked for heat on starter & solenoid , both cool to touch.
>
>
>
> It seems logical that whatever the problem is , that it is
> affecting both engines
>
> My understanding is that when the key is turned , the ground is
> momentarily connected by a switch , where is this switch located ?
>
> Both en gines would not share this switch , would they.
>
> Do both engines share the same ground?
>
> To me it seems like corrosion on a terminal , but I get 12.6 on
> the back of the battery switches between the positive and
> negative wires , from there I have 12.6 at the solenoids
>
>
>
> Any thoughts on wh at to check or what may be my problem would
> be appreciated.
>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
 

 
 
 
 

 

Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Isolated ground of my Yankar 4jh3hte #376 Kimberlite

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

I don't have the Yanmar
Sincerely, Alexandre



--------------------------------------------

On Tue, 7/25/17, kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Isolated ground of my Yankar 4jh3hte #376 Kimberlite
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Tuesday, July 25, 2017, 6:02 PM


 









Hi Vladimir,
Mine are covered in heat shrink tubing. They are
Motorola diodes . Unfortunately I ma not near the boat
today. I think Alexandre bought a few and has the number, or
you can just cut the heat shrink and read the numbers and
then just re shrink the . If I remember correctly they have
solderless connectors on each end.
Fair Winds
Eric
Sm 376 Kimberlte

----- Original Message -----
From:
"sonsev52@... [amelyachtowners]"
Date: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 6:56 pm
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Isolated
ground of my Yankar 4jh3hte #376 Kimberlite
To: amelyachtowners@...

> Hi Eric,
>
> I want to buy spare
diods. Please give me information on the
> diods that are on the coil wire of the
Valeo ground breaking
> solenoid.
>
> Vladimir
>
> SM # 345 "LIFE
IS GOOD"
>










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