Date   

Two questions

Paul Osterberg
 

We we are in the process of substituting the old B&G instruments with Raymarine instruments.

The new NMEA 2000 backbone system should be grounded. You who have NMEA 2000 how did you ground your system?

We are also putting in a new modern computer for the old and still well working Autohelm autopilots. If I remember right the clutch for both the linear and rotar drive is on 12 v and not 24 v. Anyone who can confirm that clutch should be 12 v

Paul on SY Kerpa SM 259


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Wood trim around Vee berth windows

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Kent,

I used a high quality single pot spar varnish to do those trims around the overhead hatches. Looks good and matches the original.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 01 June 2018 at 11:17 "karkauai@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

I finally got the wood trim off of the cabin sides around the porch lights. They were just stuck with copious amounts of what appears to be clear silicone. I am in the process of taking all of the old finish off and will need to re-seal the wood and finish it. I would like to use the same finish that a male used at the time of the original build. Does anyone know what finish was used? I’m guessing it’s a high tech two part polyurethane. Do you know if any stain was used?

Joel?
Olivier?

Thanks
Kent
SM 243
Kristy
St Michaels MD


 


 


Re: Wood trim around Vee berth windows

karkauai
 

I finally got the wood trim off of the cabin sides around the porch lights. They were just stuck with copious amounts of what appears to be clear silicone. I am in the process of taking all of the old finish off and will need to re-seal the wood and finish it. I would like to use the same finish that a male used at the time of the original build. Does anyone know what finish was used? I’m guessing it’s a high tech two part polyurethane. Do you know if any stain was used?

Joel?
Olivier?

Thanks
Kent
SM 243
Kristy
St Michaels MD


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

johnericmorton@...
 

Hi Joel

Thank you for your prompt reply and guidance.

There are very few Amels in NZ. I don't think the Surveyor had ever seen an Amel before.......

In this case, I've learnt that it's a bit more complex than a normal condition survey at time of purchase because Alin has in mind possibly taking out paying customers for sailing / diving trips. This means that Wanderer will need to be put "in survey" to the satisfaction of the relevant NZ agency. This is a very rigorous process - any boat going "into survey" must meet the current NZ requirements for design, construction, electrical wiring regulations etc as if the boat is a newly built NZ boat.   Hence there are "norms" such as design checks and approval and dropping down the keel for inspection of the bolts for survey as well as probably pulling out the prop shaft to check condition. All easy to do if the boat is under construction in NZ.  :)-    There is a process for applying for exemptions to these "in survey" requirements.

Fortunately the Electrical Inspector and the Surveyor were impressed with the design, overall quality, fit out, and condition. Good documentation (manuals and the standard drawings / plans) are a big plus for their design checks and their approval for "in survey".

It seems the Surveyor is happy - the results of his  "deck tapping" seems to be advisory only, not a requirement for putting Wanderer "in survey" as a requirement for use for commercial reward.

As there seems to be no history of deck de-lamination issues with Amels, this may be prove to be a red herring, the local Surveyor mentioned possible minor air gap voids at time of construction?    

Perhaps all Amel decks respond with the same beautiful tapping sounds (music to my ears) depending on the location of supports / iron wood / balsa and changes (by design) in materials and thicknesses.


Best Regards


John Morton

Amel Super Maramu #283

Auckland, New Zealand.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

amelforme
 

Hello Mr. Morton
Were you able to ascertain if the surveyor has surveyed other Amel boats or was this his first Amel inspection? I suspect the later.
I have sold hundreds of second hand Amels and I always shudder when I get a rookie surveyor/expert maritime. The typical snake/mongoose relationship evolves and it becomes very difficult to reasonably demonstrate that many of their assumptions are totally incorrect. Mainly because many surveyors are certain that all brokers are mouth breathing used car salesmen....
To all Amel sellers and especially to Amel buyers, the best Amel surveyor on the planet is Olivier Beauté who was Amel’s technical guru and after sale service honcho. He has forgotten more about Amels than any of us will ever know. If several time zones must be traversed, yep, he will be expensive. But absolutely worth every euro if the boat gives you any reason for pause. In the North American market, I have a guy, soon to retire, that has surveyed 300+ Amels for me. He gets it. Between the two of us, we are close to Olivier’s level of competence. Almost...

A thorough survey by someone familiar with the idiosyncrasies of Amel  boats is the best money you will spend when considering any Amel.

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On May 31, 2018, at 4:45 PM, johnericmorton@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Alin and Amel Owners


Just to clarify for other Amel Yacht Owners.  We are selling Wanderer after six great years of proud ownership in NZ.  When the sale goes through we plan to buy an Amel boat in the Mediterranean so we can spend six months each year in NZ then up to six months in the med live on board.  We don't have the appetite to face the challenge of sailing from NZ to Europe.

Alin's surveyor did the woodpecker thing with his light hammer on the deck and marked what he suspected could possibly be small localised areas of delamination requiring further investigation.   The underwater hull all "tapped out" OK.  :)-  and Wanderer otherwise has a clean bill of health.

The Surveyor lost a bit of credibility with me when he commented on "water ingress in the rudder"  (it's hollow by design) and his verbal recommendation to "drop off" the keel so he could check the mild steel attachment bolts.  (They are stainless steel and its not recommended to drop off the keel for inspection).

I'll get a photo of the localised crazing / hair line cracks aft of the lazarette hatch on the starboard side.  (When I tap this area now  I can't hear the difference but maybe I need 20 years of experience).   In any case, the crazing / cracks will be repaired.  The concern is about the risk of trapping in water and how to get the best finish - it look like a simple paint job but matching the faux teak surface and the painted strips in between might be a challenge.

There might already be a thread regarding crazing cracks on the faux teak strips?

Thank you in advance.

John and Mali Morton

Wanderer  ASM283

Auckland NZ


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

Alin SM 283
 

Thank you



From: "Joel Potter jfpottercys@... [amelyachtowners]"
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Friday, 1 June 2018 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

 
Hello and good luck with your Amel hunting. I sold that boat to it’s first owner who is a very dear friend. We were very discerning in the original outfitting. 
I also sold it to its second owner who sailed it to  New Zealand and resold it. 
I’ll go through my file on the boat as soon as I get to my warehouse where sold boat files are stored in the next several days and see if I have anything worthwhile to report.

All The Best, Joel

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On May 31, 2018, at 4:00 PM, alin1923@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Hi. No she does not have a staysail. I will come back with a picture.
Thank you.




Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

amelforme
 

Hello and good luck with your Amel hunting. I sold that boat to it’s first owner who is a very dear friend. We were very discerning in the original outfitting. 
I also sold it to its second owner who sailed it to  New Zealand and resold it. 
I’ll go through my file on the boat as soon as I get to my warehouse where sold boat files are stored in the next several days and see if I have anything worthwhile to report.

All The Best, Joel

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On May 31, 2018, at 4:00 PM, alin1923@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi. No she does not have a staysail. I will come back with a picture.

Thank you.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

johnericmorton@...
 

Hi Alin and Amel Owners

Just to clarify for other Amel Yacht Owners.  We are selling Wanderer after six great years of proud ownership in NZ.  When the sale goes through we plan to buy an Amel boat in the Mediterranean so we can spend six months each year in NZ then up to six months in the med live on board.  We don't have the appetite to face the challenge of sailing from NZ to Europe.

Alin's surveyor did the woodpecker thing with his light hammer on the deck and marked what he suspected could possibly be small localised areas of delamination requiring further investigation.   The underwater hull all "tapped out" OK.  :)-  and Wanderer otherwise has a clean bill of health.

The Surveyor lost a bit of credibility with me when he commented on "water ingress in the rudder"  (it's hollow by design) and his verbal recommendation to "drop off" the keel so he could check the mild steel attachment bolts.  (They are stainless steel and its not recommended to drop off the keel for inspection).

I'll get a photo of the localised crazing / hair line cracks aft of the lazarette hatch on the starboard side.  (When I tap this area now  I can't hear the difference but maybe I need 20 years of experience).   In any case, the crazing / cracks will be repaired.  The concern is about the risk of trapping in water and how to get the best finish - it look like a simple paint job but matching the faux teak surface and the painted strips in between might be a challenge.

There might already be a thread regarding crazing cracks on the faux teak strips?

Thank you in advance.

John and Mali Morton

Wanderer  ASM283

Auckland NZ


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

Alin SM 283
 

Hi. No she does not have a staysail. I will come back with a picture.
Thank you.


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Got confused with the vessel name! Thought Duane was selling his.

Alin, the best would be to take pictures showing the exact location.
Does this SM2K has (or had) a staysail?

Hope the final survey will be good

Sincerely, Alexandre (Formally #289)



--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 5/31/18, Alin Misescu alin1923@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck
To: "amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, May 31, 2018, 2:02 PM


 









Hi everyone.  This is my  very first post 
here.I
am buying (hopefully)  a SM hull 283, Wanderer in NZ.  The
surveyor found delamination in few spots on deck. 4 areas
ranging from 10 to 20 square CM.  2 of them have cracks in
the gelcoat and you can hear different noise when tapping. 
You can also feel a v slight bump when you run your hand
over it.  Any thoughts or ideas are much appreciated. 
Thank you. Alin
Misescu 
Sent
from Yahoo Mail on Android


SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

Alin SM 283
 

Hi everyone.  This is my  very first post  here.
I am buying (hopefully)  a SM hull 283, Wanderer in NZ.  The surveyor found delamination in few spots on deck. 4 areas ranging from 10 to 20 square CM.  2 of them have cracks in the gelcoat and you can hear different noise when tapping.  You can also feel a v slight bump when you run your hand over it.  Any thoughts or ideas are much appreciated.  Thank you. 
Alin Misescu 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Travel on the US East Coast

Brent Cameron
 


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Travel on the US East Coast

Duane Siegfri
 

Thanks for taking this on Pat!
Duane


Chesapeake Rendezvous

Patrick McAneny
 

I think we need to set a date for the rendezvous very soon , so plans can be made. If my wife was home I could give you the number interested to date,she is keeping the list. It is quite a few. So I want to ask, that anyone that is interested in attending and has not emailed us yet ,please do so by the end of this weekend. Include the dates that you would not be available. We will determine what date looks good for the most , and post it by sometime early next week. The rendezvous would be in St. Michaels , boats trying to arrive on a Friday ,anchor together in the large anchorage  , dinner Saturday evening , departure whenever... If you are interested in coming ,please email us direct at sailw32@...

BTW, stay late Sat. evening, Joel will be pole dancing , you don't want to miss that !

See ya there,

Pat

SM Shenanigans


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Travel on the US East Coast

Patrick McAneny
 

Duane, I was just talking about that with my wife , Diane has a spread sheet with everyone and their available dates and intends to determine a date that appears best for most. I told her I wanted to post one more time for anyone interested to email us if they are interested in attending. So I will do that now, meant to do it a couple of days ago. We will post the results very soon.
Thanks,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: sailor63109@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Thu, May 31, 2018 10:27 am
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Travel on the US East Coast

 
Has there been a date/time/place set yet for the rendezvous?

Thanks,
Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: A54 Sleipner bowthruster uneven brush wear

Sv Garulfo
 

Scott,

As promised, my feedback : no uneven wear on the brushes for us. 

Maybe the springs pushing them in are stuck? They look prone to corrosion.  


Thomas 
GARULFO 
AMEL 54 #122
Bonaire


On Mon, 28 May 2018 at 21:43, S/V Garulfo <svgarulfo@...> wrote:
Hi Bill,

I agree the motor is probably fine, as it can run in one direction. 
I can hear the big Albright double-solenoid motor-reversing contactor click for both starboard and port operation. So joystick is innocent.

I think i know what 4 relays you mean (in the plastic junction box) but didn't foresee they played a part in the thrusting operation. I assumed it was only the raising/lowering of the thruster, and that my problem was closer to the Side-Power unit. 

I measured voltage on the Albright contactor posts in port/starboard/idle operation to see if I can reverse engineer what is supposed to happen to the 4 power cables going into the motor. Need to look at the results with a fresh pair of eyes in the morning. And maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree.


Thanks as always,


Thomas 
GARULFO
AMEL 54 #122
Bonaire 

On Mon, 28 May 2018 at 21:02, Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Thomas,

It is probably not the motor and is either the joystick or one of the 4 relays. 

Eliminate the joystick first. 

It is unlikely that your relays are numbered because out of about 10 54s, I have only seen 1 with numbered relays, but they are all the same relay. If all 54s are wired the same, I think it will be relay #2, but, if you have a spare relay, it is easy enough to replace them one at a time until you find the culprit. Of course the problem can be corrosion between the relay terminals and the female spade connectors.

If I owned a 54, I would have 4 spare relays.

Good Luck!

On Mon, May 28, 2018 at 4:22 PM, 'S/V Garulfo' svgarulfo@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Hi Scott,

Talking of the devil...

I haven't looked into the carbon dust and brushes yet, cause I reconnected the thruster for a quick stop in a marina and after the initial 'all-good' tests, it decided to only thrust to port and not starboard....
So I've got a second issue to troubleshoot. If anyone has experienced it and has clues, it's very welcome. 

I'll check the state of the brushes for uneven wear too, to give you another data point. 
Note that i don't have an oil reservoir in my unit.


Fair winds to all,

Thomas
GARULFO
AMEL 54 #122
Bonaire 

On Mon, 28 May 2018 at 05:54, cpp_berkeley <no_reply@...> wrote:

Craig,


Answers to your questions below:

1) After we let it cool down (~30 minutes) it ran fine. Perhaps a bit weaker but that's probably to be expected considering that some of the brushes have worn down considerably and actually even cracked, exposing just bare conductors. My fear is that going forward, it will continue to overheat prematurely and leave us without a bow thruster when we most need it.

2) The sidepower bowthruster has a drain plug underwater between the two props and a fill reservoir in the bow locker. Obviously oil is changed on the hard. My understanding is that the way to change the oil is to open the plug and continue filling the reservoir until the oil coming out of the plug looks clean. That way, you don't get air into the system.

The mechanic drained all of the oil and he put the plug back and filled the reservoir. The next day, the oil level had dropped, indicating that the air migrated upwards (and/or the thick oil slowly migrated downwards). This drop in oil level continued for a few days. It seems reasonably stable now, but I'm unsure whether some air was still stuck in the gearleg and never made its way out..


Also, we now have a strong "Mass -" leak. Thomas of S/V Garulfo posted that he had a bow thruster leak, possibly from carbon dust. I'll go check that now and report back.

But in general, any idea why the carbon brushes would be wearing so unevenly?


Scott

A54 #69 

S/V Tengah 




---In amelyachtowners@..., wrote :


Hi Scott,

Your post raises a couple of questions. 
1. You say the unit had a thermal shutdown - did it work after it cooled  down?  Any problems?
2. In what way did the mechanic have trouble getting air out of the system? On the SN and SM one simply turns the bottom section upside down to drain and then pours in new oil. No issue with air. Perhaps the 54 is a different design that I'm not familiar with.

Craig



Hi all,


I was coming into the quay at Zante yesterday in our A54 with about 10-15 knots on the beam and used the sidepower bow thruster in 10-15 second bursts and all of the sudden, thermal shutdown!


After executing an exciting no thruster stern-to med mooring into a tight spot (with expectant spectators!) I opened up the bow thruster compartment to see a lot of carbon dust. I took the motor cover off and inspected the brushes and found that for each of the pairs (4 pairs, 8 total brushes), one was worn MUCH more than the other one. On some pairs, it's the top one that was worn more, on some, it was the bottom one. Some brushes were down to loose wire.


On the attached photo, you can see the extent of the uneven wear for one pair.


We recently had the boatyard change the bowthruster oil and they drained it all before adding new oil, which resulted in challenges getting all the air out of the system. We then completed a 1350 mile passage. These probably have nothing to do with it, but maybe I'm wrong.


Before I go out and spend money to replace the brushes and possibly experience similar uneven wear, anyone have any ideas as to why this happened and how to rectify it?


Thanks!


Scott

A54 #69 

S/V Tengah 



 



Re: Travel on the US East Coast

Duane Siegfri
 

Has there been a date/time/place set yet for the rendezvous?

Thanks,
Duane
Wanderer, SM#477


Gas shut off

Patrick McAneny
 

I am not getting any power to my propane switch. I bought a wire tracer and cannot trace the wire. The solenoid is 12v . Does anyone know where the 12v power source would originate? I could not find a 12v buss bar . The solenoid works , I jumped it across the starter battery , with a meter I cannot find any voltage at the switch. It could be as simple as a blown fuse.

Thanks,

Pat SM#123


Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Bow Thruster Rusted Shut [1 Attachment]

rettirc@...
 

About 8 months ago took me 3 days of frustration, fearing the worst, thinking that it would never come out. It eventually came.

Just be persistent as mentioned, keep spraying penetrating oil you will get there.

I just removed the thruster again this week for new gears, it was out in 30 minutes.

Tonight I shall be reinstating the unit.

Can't wait to test it with new gears and prop.

Chris
Jaygo
SM224


Re: Bow Thruster Rusted Shut

greatketch@...
 

When we had our main drive motor rebuilt, we were told by company that did the work that about the only thing that kills these motors is if the splined shaft wears out or is otherwise damaged.  As far as I know these motors are now irreplaceable (if somebody know otherwise, please speak up!).

In short, you will HAVE to get the shaft out of the motor.  Work really long and really hard at it.  DO not cut the shaft.  That will cause a cascade of issues that will be really hard to put right.  Remember, the shaft is a carbon fiber tube, with a steel drive shaft inside.  I can not think of a way to put it back together so it will work as it should.

This will be really hard, but worth taking all the advice available on the forum and trying ALL of it.  When you DO get it apart, you will understand why the maintenance schedule is to drop this at least every two years and apply a good waterproof grease to the splines.  

If properly maintained, this won't ever be a problem again.  After reading so many horror stories on here about this issue, I was dreading my first bow thruster maintenance. Harmonie's previous owner did such a good job maintaining things, when I took out the last of the four bolts, the drive unit fell out of the motor all by itself with only gravity pulling.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Deltaville, VA, USA

---In amelyachtowners@..., <steve@...> wrote :

Complete Fail.
I tried everything, but that shaft is not coming out. Ever. I was super clamped on with the custom tool that I had made. Can't say how much force was on that thing, but it was enough to make it impossible to turn those four bolts. Best I can think of is that the spindled shaft inside has fused to the receiver. I'll have to dive the prop to replace. "Changing prop while boat is in the water" is off the table. Going to have to cut that shaft if I ever want it to come out, I'm afraid. Open to all ideas...
-Capt Bode

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