Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost


Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
 

Hi,

Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a
fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where
the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or
less expensive.

While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the
best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included
transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find
the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the
parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice
the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid...  the cost for
the parts became horrendous!

This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing
rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been
closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a
professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or
more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during
hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one
that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger
consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the
best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every
part...


Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China
made parts and wire to replace riggings...


I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,
Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar
equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the
electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the
outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.

On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears
maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be
concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of
sophistication of the boat.


SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple
of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined
that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in
le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is
highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a
owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.

My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not
only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a
days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific
island cuising.

Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,
one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was
asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive
for you!

Serge,      V&#92;  Opera    Mango#51


Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Dear Serge, I am very happy to have your feedback as the Mango seems more in my budget.  If I am not mistaking the Nirvana is an electric in-mast furling, does it work well?  Are you happy with it?  I read Amel went on designing their in-house in-mast furling… 
 
You mentioned your Mango is in Martinique during hurricane season, could you please let me know how much is your insurance (just the percentage), my research tells me (in the US, near Houston, TX) for 25 year old boat, I will pay 3% per year. So for example for 200,000 will be 6,000 per year.
 
I am glad to read your opinion on Amel having the lowest maintenance cost.  After being on a Super Maramu, I love the space, the concept, equipments, etc. but they seem quite expensive to up-keep and I feel like a less sophisticated or smaller Maramu or Mango would be less financially stressful to own. 
 
For information here is the intended goal:
-A year from now: purchasing the vessel.  Live aboard right away.
- The next 4 years, “local” (day or weekend) sailing to fix the bugs and put the vessel in excellent sailing condition.  
-Then the following 10 years, slowing sailing around South America then eventually back to Europe; sail for 2 or 3 days then anchor for 2 weeks to a month.
 
Regarding the costs: I don’t want to be stressed about expenses.  I will be fine spending $18,000 (average) per year on maintenance (in addition to the $6,000 Marina slip, $6,000 insurance and fuel), but I don’t want to purchase a vessel which end up costing $30,000 per years on maintenance alone.  
 
I heard about the Pierpont Morgan expression: “If you have to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it”. 
 
Thanks again for taking the time to respond, I truly appreciate all of the responses so far.  Sincerely, Alexandre

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...> wrote:


From: Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
Subject: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:48 AM


 



Hi,

Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a
fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where
the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or
less expensive.

While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the
best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included
transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find
the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the
parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice
the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid...  the cost for
the parts became horrendous!

This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing
rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been
closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a
professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or
more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during
hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one
that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger
consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the
best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every
part...

Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China
made parts and wire to replace riggings...

I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,
Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar
equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the
electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the
outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.

On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears
maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be
concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of
sophistication of the boat.

SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple
of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined
that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in
le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is
highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a
owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.

My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not
only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a
days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific
island cuising.

Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,
one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was
asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive
for you!

Serge,      V&#92;  Opera    Mango#51

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
 

Serg if you are looking for a Gen set replacement we did a Bata unit it is a bolt In everything matches up. That is because it appears to be the same confit that Onan uses.

Good luck fair winds

Richard Piller sm 209 for sale

On Nov 17, 2010, at 1:48, Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...> wrote:

Hi,

Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a
fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where
the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or
less expensive.

While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the
best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included
transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find
the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the
parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice
the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid... the cost for
the parts became horrendous!

This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing
rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been
closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a
professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or
more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during
hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one
that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger
consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the
best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every
part...

Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China
made parts and wire to replace riggings...

I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,
Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar
equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the
electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the
outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.

On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears
maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be
concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of
sophistication of the boat.

SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple
of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined
that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in
le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is
highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a
owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.

My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not
only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a
days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific
island cuising.

Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,
one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was
asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive
for you!

Serge, V&#92; Opera Mango#51

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


karkauai
 

On insurance, Alex, I am spending $3600 per year as a new owner of SM243, never having owned a sailboat before.  I am limited to sailing in and around US and Canadian waters, all of the Caribbean and S America except the waters of Cuba, Haiti, and the Domican Republic.  I have to be north of GA/FL border or south of Grenada during the hurricane season.  It will cost more when I do a transoceanic voyage, but by that time I  should have enough experience to allow for lower rate.
Kent

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...> wrote:


From: Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...>
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Cc: laetitiaii@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 9:51 AM


 





Dear Serge, I am very happy to have your feedback as the Mango seems more in my budget.  If I am not mistaking the Nirvana is an electric in-mast furling, does it work well?  Are you happy with it?  I read Amel went on designing their in-house in-mast furling… 
 
You mentioned your Mango is in Martinique during hurricane season, could you please let me know how much is your insurance (just the percentage), my research tells me (in the US, near Houston, TX) for 25 year old boat, I will pay 3% per year. So for example for 200,000 will be 6,000 per year.
 
I am glad to read your opinion on Amel having the lowest maintenance cost.  After being on a Super Maramu, I love the space, the concept, equipments, etc. but they seem quite expensive to up-keep and I feel like a less sophisticated or smaller Maramu or Mango would be less financially stressful to own. 
 
For information here is the intended goal:
-A year from now: purchasing the vessel.  Live aboard right away.
- The next 4 years, “local” (day or weekend) sailing to fix the bugs and put the vessel in excellent sailing condition.  
-Then the following 10 years, slowing sailing around South America then eventually back to Europe; sail for 2 or 3 days then anchor for 2 weeks to a month.
 
Regarding the costs: I don’t want to be stressed about expenses.  I will be fine spending $18,000 (average) per year on maintenance (in addition to the $6,000 Marina slip, $6,000 insurance and fuel), but I don’t want to purchase a vessel which end up costing $30,000 per years on maintenance alone.  
 
I heard about the Pierpont Morgan expression: “If you have to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it”. 
 
Thanks again for taking the time to respond, I truly appreciate all of the responses so far.  Sincerely, Alexandre

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...> wrote:

From: Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
Subject: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:48 AM

 

Hi,

Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a
fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where
the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or
less expensive.

While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the
best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included
transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find
the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the
parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice
the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid...  the cost for
the parts became horrendous!

This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing
rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been
closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a
professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or
more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during
hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one
that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger
consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the
best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every
part...

Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China
made parts and wire to replace riggings...

I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,
Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar
equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the
electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the
outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.

On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears
maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be
concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of
sophistication of the boat.

SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple
of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined
that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in
le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is
highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a
owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.

My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not
only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a
days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific
island cuising.

Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,
one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was
asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive
for you!

Serge,      V&#92;  Opera    Mango#51

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Paul LaFrance <pflafrance@...>
 

Kent
The insurance rate your paying is good. If possible could you provide the contact name of your insurer? We are currently paying $4,600 for similar coverage.
Paul LaFrance
Nomad SM 362


To: amelyachtowners@...
From: karkauai@...
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2010 10:19:01 -0800
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost




























On insurance, Alex, I am spending $3600 per year as a new owner of SM243, never having owned a sailboat before. I am limited to sailing in and around US and Canadian waters, all of the Caribbean and S America except the waters of Cuba, Haiti, and the Domican Republic. I have to be north of GA/FL border or south of Grenada during the hurricane season. It will cost more when I do a transoceanic voyage, but by that time I should have enough experience to allow for lower rate.

Kent

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...> wrote:



From: Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...>

Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost

To: amelyachtowners@...

Cc: laetitiaii@...

Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 9:51 AM







Dear Serge, I am very happy to have your feedback as the Mango seems more in my budget. If I am not mistaking the Nirvana is an electric in-mast furling, does it work well? Are you happy with it? I read Amel went on designing their in-house in-mast furling



You mentioned your Mango is in Martinique during hurricane season, could you please let me know how much is your insurance (just the percentage), my research tells me (in the US, near Houston, TX) for 25 year old boat, I will pay 3% per year. So for example for 200,000 will be 6,000 per year.



I am glad to read your opinion on Amel having the lowest maintenance cost. After being on a Super Maramu, I love the space, the concept, equipments, etc. but they seem quite expensive to up-keep and I feel like a less sophisticated or smaller Maramu or Mango would be less financially stressful to own.



For information here is the intended goal:

-A year from now: purchasing the vessel. Live aboard right away.

- The next 4 years, local (day or weekend) sailing to fix the bugs and put the vessel in excellent sailing condition.

-Then the following 10 years, slowing sailing around South America then eventually back to Europe; sail for 2 or 3 days then anchor for 2 weeks to a month.



Regarding the costs: I dont want to be stressed about expenses. I will be fine spending $18,000 (average) per year on maintenance (in addition to the $6,000 Marina slip, $6,000 insurance and fuel), but I dont want to purchase a vessel which end up costing $30,000 per years on maintenance alone.



I heard about the Pierpont Morgan expression: If you have to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it.



Thanks again for taking the time to respond, I truly appreciate all of the responses so far. Sincerely, Alexandre



--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...> wrote:



From: Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>

Subject: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost

To: amelyachtowners@...

Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:48 AM







Hi,



Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a

fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where

the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or

less expensive.



While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the

best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included

transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find

the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the

parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice

the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid... the cost for

the parts became horrendous!



This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing

rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been

closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a

professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or

more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during

hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one

that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger

consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the

best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every

part...



Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China

made parts and wire to replace riggings...



I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,

Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar

equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the

electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the

outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.



On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears

maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be

concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of

sophistication of the boat.



SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple

of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined

that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in

le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is

highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a

owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.



My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not

only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a

days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific

island cuising.



Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,

one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was

asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive

for you!



Serge, V&#92; Opera Mango#51



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Hello Kent, this is really reasonable insurance.  I have own boats for the last 6 years, but no sailboat.  US waters will be fine for the first 4 years.  My problem is that I live near Houston, TX… so in Hurricane area.  But could you please forward me the insurance company you are using.  Thanks in advance, sincerely, Alexandre 713-412-6704

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote:


From: Kent Robertson <karkauai@...>
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:19 PM


 



On insurance, Alex, I am spending $3600 per year as a new owner of SM243, never having owned a sailboat before.  I am limited to sailing in and around US and Canadian waters, all of the Caribbean and S America except the waters of Cuba, Haiti, and the Domican Republic.  I have to be north of GA/FL border or south of Grenada during the hurricane season.  It will cost more when I do a transoceanic voyage, but by that time I  should have enough experience to allow for lower rate.
Kent

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...> wrote:

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...>
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Cc: laetitiaii@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 9:51 AM

 

Dear Serge, I am very happy to have your feedback as the Mango seems more in my budget.  If I am not mistaking the Nirvana is an electric in-mast furling, does it work well?  Are you happy with it?  I read Amel went on designing their in-house in-mast furling… 
 
You mentioned your Mango is in Martinique during hurricane season, could you please let me know how much is your insurance (just the percentage), my research tells me (in the US, near Houston, TX) for 25 year old boat, I will pay 3% per year. So for example for 200,000 will be 6,000 per year.
 
I am glad to read your opinion on Amel having the lowest maintenance cost.  After being on a Super Maramu, I love the space, the concept, equipments, etc. but they seem quite expensive to up-keep and I feel like a less sophisticated or smaller Maramu or Mango would be less financially stressful to own. 
 
For information here is the intended goal:
-A year from now: purchasing the vessel.  Live aboard right away.
- The next 4 years, “local” (day or weekend) sailing to fix the bugs and put the vessel in excellent sailing condition.  
-Then the following 10 years, slowing sailing around South America then eventually back to Europe; sail for 2 or 3 days then anchor for 2 weeks to a month.
 
Regarding the costs: I don’t want to be stressed about expenses.  I will be fine spending $18,000 (average) per year on maintenance (in addition to the $6,000 Marina slip, $6,000 insurance and fuel), but I don’t want to purchase a vessel which end up costing $30,000 per years on maintenance alone.  
 
I heard about the Pierpont Morgan expression: “If you have to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it”. 
 
Thanks again for taking the time to respond, I truly appreciate all of the responses so far.  Sincerely, Alexandre

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...> wrote:

From: Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
Subject: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:48 AM

 

Hi,

Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a
fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where
the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or
less expensive.

While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the
best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included
transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find
the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the
parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice
the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid...  the cost for
the parts became horrendous!

This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing
rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been
closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a
professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or
more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during
hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one
that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger
consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the
best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every
part...

Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China
made parts and wire to replace riggings...

I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,
Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar
equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the
electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the
outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.

On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears
maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be
concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of
sophistication of the boat.

SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple
of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined
that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in
le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is
highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a
owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.

My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not
only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a
days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific
island cuising.

Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,
one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was
asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive
for you!

Serge,      V&#92;  Opera    Mango#51

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Richard Piller <richard03801@...>
 

Hello all we as members of SSCA which we should all be we get a deal from Al
Golden at Jack Line. Our insurance for being the Annapolis area is less then
2100.... with the SSCA and Power Squad discounts.
Richard on SM 209 For Sale





________________________________
From: Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...>
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Wed, November 17, 2010 4:27:06 PM
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost




Hello Kent, this is really reasonable insurance. I have own boats for the last
6 years, but no sailboat. US waters will be fine for the first 4 years. My
problem is that I live near Houston, TX… so in Hurricane area. But could you
please forward me the insurance company you are using. Thanks in advance,
sincerely, Alexandre 713-412-6704

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote:

From: Kent Robertson <karkauai@...>
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:19 PM



On insurance, Alex, I am spending $3600 per year as a new owner of SM243, never
having owned a sailboat before. I am limited to sailing in and around US and
Canadian waters, all of the Caribbean and S America except the waters of Cuba,
Haiti, and the Domican Republic. I have to be north of GA/FL border or south of
Grenada during the hurricane season. It will cost more when I do a transoceanic
voyage, but by that time I should have enough experience to allow for lower
rate.
Kent

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...> wrote:

From: Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...>
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Cc: laetitiaii@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 9:51 AM



Dear Serge, I am very happy to have your feedback as the Mango seems more in my
budget. If I am not mistaking the Nirvana is an electric in-mast furling, does
it work well? Are you happy with it? I read Amel went on designing their
in-house in-mast furling…


You mentioned your Mango is in Martinique during hurricane season, could you
please let me know how much is your insurance (just the percentage), my research
tells me (in the US, near Houston, TX) for 25 year old boat, I will pay 3% per
year. So for example for 200,000 will be 6,000 per year.


I am glad to read your opinion on Amel having the lowest maintenance cost.
After being on a Super Maramu, I love the space, the concept, equipments, etc.
but they seem quite expensive to up-keep and I feel like a less sophisticated or
smaller Maramu or Mango would be less financially stressful to own.


For information here is the intended goal:
-A year from now: purchasing the vessel. Live aboard right away.
- The next 4 years, “local” (day or weekend) sailing to fix the bugs and put the
vessel in excellent sailing condition.

-Then the following 10 years, slowing sailing around South America then
eventually back to Europe; sail for 2 or 3 days then anchor for 2 weeks to a
month.


Regarding the costs: I don’t want to be stressed about expenses. I will be fine
spending $18,000 (average) per year on maintenance (in addition to the $6,000
Marina slip, $6,000 insurance and fuel), but I don’t want to purchase a vessel
which end up costing $30,000 per years on maintenance alone.


I heard about the Pierpont Morgan expression: “If you have to ask how much it
costs, you can't afford it”.


Thanks again for taking the time to respond, I truly appreciate all of the
responses so far. Sincerely, Alexandre

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...> wrote:

From: Serge Tremblay <laetitiaii@...>
Subject: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 12:48 AM



Hi,

Maintenance cost vary from year to year but 10% of the value does represent a
fair amount for my 1985 Mango. I do a lot of the work, but depending of where
the boat is, competent help is sometimes difficult to find or parts are more or
less expensive.

While in Spain in 2006, I found that Transatlantic Diesel in the US offered the
best price for spare pumps for my Perkins main engine and this included
transportation fee by Fed Ex. However the Fed Ex delivery person did not find
the boat in the marina where I had been for 3 months and simply returned the
parts to the US, charging return fee to the sender. I had to repay again twice
the transportation fee to get the parts that I had already paid... the cost for

the parts became horrendous!

This year I have to replace the Onan Genset as well as most of my standing
rigging. As an experienced sailor I have assured that the rigging has been
closely inspected and replaced where it was needed. However the surveyor and a
professional rigger refuse to give any certification for rigging 10 year old or
more, and the insurer which accept coverage for my boat in Martinique during
hurricane season refuses to cover the boat unless the rigging is changed by one
that can be certified. On the other hand the experienced rigger
consulted advised me that the Nirvana (Swiss) rigging used on my boat is the
best - but Nirvana engraved a serial no and the date of manufacture on every
part...

Meanwhile, it is not uncommon for riggers in the Caribeans to use cheap China
made parts and wire to replace riggings...

I have owned saiboats for the last 45 years, sailed a bit and, in my opinion,
Amel boats have a lower maintenance cost than comparable vessels with similar
equipment. The hull, the rigging, the main engine, the liquid circuits, the
electrical wiring and electronic components are not only first quality from the
outset, but usually the installation is sturdy and practical.

On the other hand, if the request by Alexandre is made because he fears
maintenance fees are a serious concern. I would suggest that he should then be
concerned by the size of the model of Amel chosen and the level of
sophistication of the boat.

SM or Mango and Maramu were built as reliable world cruisers handled by a couple

of young retiree. For most sailors, the boat builders industrie has determined
that the boat will sail about 15 days per year... and after docking my boat in
le Vieux Port of Marseille for 2 months, I beleive that 15 days of sailing is
highly exagerated for local boatowner. So if maintenance costs are an issue, a
owner should first be determining what is his intended use of the boat.

My Mango has more than 220gal of fuel capacity in two reservoirs. This is not
only useless for sunday sailors but also for those who can access fuel on a
days' notice, it is however most conforting in ocean crossings and South Pacific

island cuising.

Finally, with due respect for Alexandre to whom this comment is not directed,
one could recall the harsh comment made by a Rolls Royce car saleman who was
asked about the fuel cost for the car by a prospective client: Its too expensive

for you!

Serge, V&#92; Opera Mango#51

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Chris Smither <yachtakwaaba@...>
 

Hi all,
     Having just moved "ashore" after nearly 10 years of living aboard - we still have the Santorin - I have found that I grossly underestimated the amount of "little" maintenance jobs that you both do, every day, almost without noticing. These are jobs that my irreverent brother calls "fettling"
This means that without you really noticing lots of small problems get solved before they become big ones, whereas if you only get on the boat once or twice a week.......need I say more.
 Thus I believe that your maintenance costs are very much lower if you live aboard. And, dare I say it  that is another reason a boat is a "she" - you neglect them at your peril! (loud groan from Christine in the background).

Mike & Chris SN 27


Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Chris,
Where is your Santorin located?  As I wrote previously, I am in Colorado until May, but after will go to look at several Amel.  My time frame is to purchase a year from now.  How was your experience living aboard?  (This is what I want to do).  How about the A/C?  Do you have an estimated average yearly cost for the maintenance? (Hoses, filters, bearings, bushings, seals, etc.).  Did you use an external generator?  I know a lot of questions… Thanks in advance, sincerely, Alexandre

--- On Wed, 11/17/10, Chris Smither <yachtakwaaba@...> wrote:


From: Chris Smither <yachtakwaaba@...>
Subject: Re: Re : [Amel] Amel yearly upkeep cost
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Wednesday, November 17, 2010, 7:31 PM


 




Hi all,
     Having just moved "ashore" after nearly 10 years of living aboard - we still have the Santorin - I have found that I grossly underestimated the amount of "little" maintenance jobs that you both do, every day, almost without noticing. These are jobs that my irreverent brother calls "fettling"
This means that without you really noticing lots of small problems get solved before they become big ones, whereas if you only get on the boat once or twice a week.......need I say more.
 Thus I believe that your maintenance costs are very much lower if you live aboard. And, dare I say it  that is another reason a boat is a "she" - you neglect them at your peril! (loud groan from Christine in the background).

Mike & Chris SN 27