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[Amel] Domestic Water pressure switch.
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Hi, all,
I've been looking at the link Eric sent about our fresh water pumping system. There is a tremendous amount of info on this site and I recommend that you save the link. I have a short-cycling pump on Kristy (SM 243) now and will be trouble shooting it next time I get back on the boat. I have a couple of questions about our Amel systems: 1. Is the pressure tank at the pump one that has a bladder? 2. How does the additional reservoir/tank above the water heater add to the system? 3. What are the common problems you've found with our systems? 4. Since our pressure tanks are small compared to the ones featured in the site at Eric's link, I'm not sure how long it should be between pump cycles. It's always been 10-12 seconds on my boat until now, but I'm not sure that's what it should be. The pump that was on my boat when I got it wouldn't turn on at all, so I replaced it with a spare that had been purchased by the original owner. I haven't had any problems for 5 years now until now. Thanks for your thoughts/advice. Kent SM243 Kristy ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@...> To: amelyachtowners@... Sent: Tuesday, June 4, 2013 1:00 AM Subject: [Amel] Domestic Water pressure switch. http://inspectapedia.com/water/WaterPumpAdjust.htm#H1 This is the correct link Thanks for the info Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of seafeverofcuan Sent: Sunday, June 02, 2013 5:19 PM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: [Amel] Re: Venting fresh water system after complete drain down Hi Martin, There are two adjustment nuts underneath the grey plastic regulator cover. No 1 is the range nut, No 2 is the differential which should set the flow pressure. Then adjust the first one to set the "cut in" and "cut out". The factory setting is around 20PSI . There is a comprehensive explanation sheet on Inspectapedia/water/WaterPumpAdjust.htm If you can't find that I have saved it for you. Email me using my full name and hotmail.com. Regards, Trevor Lusty Sea Fever of Cuan SM 425 Mexico --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "Martin" <yachtcaduceus@...> wrote: housing through the vent plug was enough to get the system going. replacement accumulator tank that AMEL supplied to me. for 2013 on page 482 as Model 492739 with a price of $324.99. standard adaptors bridged the difference. The top plate requires drilling for the Reya pump. I also had to replace the rubber mountings and the ones supplied by AMEL had a larger thread so the mounting plates required drilling and tapping to take the replacements. before the pumop cuts in. Any advice on how to adjust the pressure cutout? <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "seafeverofcuan" <seafeverofcuan@> wrote: have to prime it. Take off the hose from the fresh water reservoir and fill it with water, there used to be a bleed bolt on the top of the pump that you need to loosen until the water is free flowing from the reservoir. <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "Martin" <yachtcaduceus@>Good luck. wrote: sorry if this is a repeat request. up to our ears in antifopuling, polishing etc prior to relaunch. I have in the midst of this fitted a replacement accumulator tank to the system. The original had rusted and was leaking air. Shurflo packaging. Made in Italy, shipped to the USA, back to France and then sent to us in the USA. If anyone is interested I will post the Shurflo model number, just do not have it to hand whilst writing this. Also note that the original (Amel 54 no 56) had a male fitting and the replacement has a female fitting so adapters are required. bleed the air out of the system. We also have an empty hot water tank as the boat had been winterised before I carried this out so there is a lot of air in the syatem.
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Dr Jörg Steffen <joerg.steffen@...>
Hi all,
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I am going to buy a 46 foot Amel, so just now I own only a "low quality" boat like the last 30 years. All of my 10 former boats didn have a complex water system like yours, only a modern shurflo pump for 100-150$. Connect it with 12 or 24 Volt, connect it with the big water tank and with the pipes, ready. It runs very quiet and you get 5 years warranty. It runs about 10 sec, the water runs 30 sec and the pump starts again. Keep it simple Joerg Am 11.06.2013 16:48, schrieb Kent Robertson:
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Richard03801 <richard03801@...>
We just changed out the pump and tank system on another SM to an on demand pump to halt just on off problems and save battery life as well. It works great. We also replaced the AC salt water pump with a March pump. Smaller and sealed. With water cooled bearings.
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Regards Richard Piller Cell 603 767 5330 On Jun 11, 2013, at 10:48, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote:
Hi, all, I've been looking at the link Eric sent about our fresh water pumping system. There is a tremendous amount of info on this site and I recommend that you save the link. I have a short-cycling pump on Kristy (SM 243) now and will be trouble shooting it next time I get back on the boat. I have a couple of questions about our Amel systems: 1. Is the pressure tank at the pump one that has a bladder? 2. How does the additional reservoir/tank above the water heater add to the system? 3. What are the common problems you've found with our systems? 4. Since our pressure tanks are small compared to the ones featured in the site at Eric's link, I'm not sure how long it should be between pump cycles. It's always been 10-12 seconds on my boat until now, but I'm not sure that's what it should be. The pump that was on my boat when I got it wouldn't turn on at all, so I replaced it with a spare that had been purchased by the original owner. I haven't had any problems for 5 years now until now. Thanks for your thoughts/advice. Kent SM243 Kristy ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@...> To: amelyachtowners@... Sent: Tuesday, June 4, 2013 1:00 AM Subject: [Amel] Domestic Water pressure switch. http://inspectapedia.com/water/WaterPumpAdjust.htm#H1 This is the correct link Thanks for the info Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of seafeverofcuan Sent: Sunday, June 02, 2013 5:19 PM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: [Amel] Re: Venting fresh water system after complete drain down Hi Martin, There are two adjustment nuts underneath the grey plastic regulator cover. No 1 is the range nut, No 2 is the differential which should set the flow pressure. Then adjust the first one to set the "cut in" and "cut out". The factory setting is around 20PSI . There is a comprehensive explanation sheet on Inspectapedia/water/WaterPumpAdjust.htm If you can't find that I have saved it for you. Email me using my full name and hotmail.com. Regards, Trevor Lusty Sea Fever of Cuan SM 425 Mexico --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "Martin" <yachtcaduceus@...> wrote: housing through the vent plug was enough to get the system going. replacement accumulator tank that AMEL supplied to me. for 2013 on page 482 as Model 492739 with a price of $324.99. standard adaptors bridged the difference. The top plate requires drilling for the Reya pump. I also had to replace the rubber mountings and the ones supplied by AMEL had a larger thread so the mounting plates required drilling and tapping to take the replacements. before the pumop cuts in. Any advice on how to adjust the pressure cutout? <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "seafeverofcuan" <seafeverofcuan@> wrote: have to prime it. Take off the hose from the fresh water reservoir and fill it with water, there used to be a bleed bolt on the top of the pump that you need to loosen until the water is free flowing from the reservoir. <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "Martin" <yachtcaduceus@>Good luck. wrote: sorry if this is a repeat request. up to our ears in antifopuling, polishing etc prior to relaunch. I have in the midst of this fitted a replacement accumulator tank to the system. The original had rusted and was leaking air. Shurflo packaging. Made in Italy, shipped to the USA, back to France and then sent to us in the USA. If anyone is interested I will post the Shurflo model number, just do not have it to hand whilst writing this. Also note that the original (Amel 54 no 56) had a male fitting and the replacement has a female fitting so adapters are required. bleed the air out of the system. We also have an empty hot water tank as the boat had been winterised before I carried this out so there is a lot of air in the syatem.
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Thanks, Richard. Do you eliminate the pressure/accumulator tank(s) when doing this?
Kent ________________________________ From: Richard03801 <richard03801@...> To: "amelyachtowners@..." <amelyachtowners@...> Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2013 2:06 PM Subject: Re: [Amel] Domestic Water pressure switch. We just changed out the pump and tank system on another SM to an on demand pump to halt just on off problems and save battery life as well. It works great. We also replaced the AC salt water pump with a March pump. Smaller and sealed. With water cooled bearings. Regards Richard Piller Cell 603 767 5330 On Jun 11, 2013, at 10:48, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: Hi, all, I've been looking at the link Eric sent about our fresh water pumping system. There is a tremendous amount of info on this site and I recommend that you save the link. I have a short-cycling pump on Kristy (SM 243) now and will be trouble shooting it next time I get back on the boat. I have a couple of questions about our Amel systems: 1. Is the pressure tank at the pump one that has a bladder? 2. How does the additional reservoir/tank above the water heater add to the system? 3. What are the common problems you've found with our systems? 4. Since our pressure tanks are small compared to the ones featured in the site at Eric's link, I'm not sure how long it should be between pump cycles. It's always been 10-12 seconds on my boat until now, but I'm not sure that's what it should be. The pump that was on my boat when I got it wouldn't turn on at all, so I replaced it with a spare that had been purchased by the original owner. I haven't had any problems for 5 years now until now. Thanks for your thoughts/advice. Kent SM243 Kristy ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@...> To: amelyachtowners@... Sent: Tuesday, June 4, 2013 1:00 AM Subject: [Amel] Domestic Water pressure switch. http://inspectapedia.com/water/WaterPumpAdjust.htm#H1 This is the correct link Thanks for the info Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of seafeverofcuan Sent: Sunday, June 02, 2013 5:19 PM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: [Amel] Re: Venting fresh water system after complete drain down Hi Martin, There are two adjustment nuts underneath the grey plastic regulator cover. No 1 is the range nut, No 2 is the differential which should set the flow pressure. Then adjust the first one to set the "cut in" and "cut out". The factory setting is around 20PSI . There is a comprehensive explanation sheet on Inspectapedia/water/WaterPumpAdjust.htm If you can't find that I have saved it for you. Email me using my full name and hotmail.com. Regards, Trevor Lusty Sea Fever of Cuan SM 425 Mexico --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "Martin" <yachtcaduceus@...> wrote: housing through the vent plug was enough to get the system going. replacement accumulator tank that AMEL supplied to me. for 2013 on page 482 as Model 492739 with a price of $324.99. standard adaptors bridged the difference. The top plate requires drilling for the Reya pump. I also had to replace the rubber mountings and the ones supplied by AMEL had a larger thread so the mounting plates required drilling and tapping to take the replacements. before the pumop cuts in. Any advice on how to adjust the pressure cutout? <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "seafeverofcuan" <seafeverofcuan@> wrote: have to prime it. Take off the hose from the fresh water reservoir and fill it with water, there used to be a bleed bolt on the top of the pump that you need to loosen until the water is free flowing from the reservoir. <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , "Martin" <yachtcaduceus@>Good luck. wrote: sorry if this is a repeat request. up to our ears in antifopuling, polishing etc prior to relaunch. I have in the midst of this fitted a replacement accumulator tank to the system. The original had rusted and was leaking air. Shurflo packaging. Made in Italy, shipped to the USA, back to France and then sent to us in the USA. If anyone is interested I will post the Shurflo model number, just do not have it to hand whilst writing this. Also note that the original (Amel 54 no 56) had a male fitting and the replacement has a female fitting so adapters are required. bleed the air out of the system. We also have an empty hot water tank as the boat had been winterised before I carried this out so there is a lot of air in the syatem.
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amelliahona <no_reply@...>
Hi Kent:
In answer to your questions: Q. 1. Is the pressure tank at the pump one that has a bladder?A. If this is the original Amel accumulator tank (stainless) attached to the pump, then yes it does have a bladder. Almost accumulator tanks will have a air pressure valve on one end. It looks like a valve stem for an auto or bicycle tire tube. Q 2. How does the additional reservoir/tank above the water heater add to the system?A. I am virtually positive that the accumulator tank on the hot water heater side is to allow for water expansion as it heats. Many hot water systems in industrial and residential systems have similar accumulator tanks. Q 3. What are the common problems you've found with our systems?A. I have found the system to be very good. My biggest obstacle was understanding British Straight Pipe Thread (no taper to the thread and depends on sealant to achieve a seal) as opposed to NPT (National Pipe Thread) which are tapered pipe thread and achieve a seal by means of interference fit of the threads. I have made peace with BSPT and have actually grown to like it better than NPT, especially when it comes time to disassemble something. The only real problem I had was the hot water side accumulator tank rusting through at the neck fitting. This occurred twice and has been reported by others. I believe it was a manufacturing defect. Q 4. Since our pressure tanks are small compared to the ones featured in the site at Eric's link, I'm not sure how long it should be between pump cycles. It's always been 10-12 seconds on my boat until now, but I'm not sure that's what it should be.A. I don't have a firm answer for this. The water pump originally supplied by Amel is a centrifugal pump and not a positive displacement pump. How long the pump runs depends on the setting of the pressure switch on the pump and only slightly due to wear of the impeller or the pump cavity. As you mentioned, the cold water accumulator is small and so cycling will be fairly frequent. Larger accumulators would cycle less frequently but when the pump comes on it will run for a longer period of time to "fill" or charge the accumulator tank. Q. The pump that was on my boat when I got it wouldn't turn on at all, so I replaced it with a spare that had been purchased by the original owner. I haven't had any problems for 5 years now until now.A. I think your experience is pretty typical. I have gone through two pumps in 12 years. One failure mode I experienced was the woodruff key that secures the pump impeller on the motor shaft was made of mild steel and corroded away, This left the bronze impeller unable to turn with the stainless motor shaft. I fabricated stainless woodruff keys from stainless bar stock and haven't had a recurrence. (woodruff keys are the semicircular keys that fit in a groove in the pump shaft and affix the impeller in place against rotational counterforce). Hope this helps, Gary s/v Liahona |
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Thanks Gary, as usual you've answered all my questions and I am now ready to jump on this job when I get back to the boat.
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I'm recuperating nicely since surgery and am walking several blocks at a time. Still a long way from twisting up into a pretzel to work on the boat. If it was anything but an Amel, I'd probly have to give it up. Thanks again to all. Kent SM243 Kristy Brunswick, GA, USA On Jun 11, 2013, at 5:40 PM, amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:
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Richard Piller <richard03801@...>
The answer is yes. There is no longer a need for the tank. You get steady pressure all the time.
Regards Capt Richard Piller On Jun 11, 2013, at 14:26, Kent Robertson <karkauai@...> wrote: Thanks, Richard. Do you eliminate the pressure/accumulator tank(s) when doing this? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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amelliahona <no_reply@...>
Richard:
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Can you share with the forum the make and model of the on demand pump(s) that you used for the fresh water system? I used a March submersible magnetic coupled impeller pump, 230 volt 50/60 hertz like this http://www.marchpump.com/lc-3cp-md/ for the sea water for the 4th Air Conditioning unit that I installed in the galley. It is quiet, maintenance free, has no seals to wear out or leak etc. The only down side was it was a bit expensive at US$585.00. They make various sizes but this one met the specifications for the Climma Compact 10 AC unit I installed. I could have used the excess sea water from the Calpeda pump used for all the other AC units but I wanted a separate pump for redundancy. Ray Eaton (Joel's Amel guru in Ft. Lauderdale, now deceased) changed my sea water anchor wash-down pump to a fresh water system using piggy backed Jabsco on demand pumps. I now use that system to wash the entire boat while at anchor. Unfortunately I don't know the model numbers of those pumps. It has been a great asset tot he boat. Gary We just changed out the pump and tank system on another SM to an on demand pump to halt just on off problems and save battery life as well. It works great. We also replaced the AC salt water pump with a March pump. Smaller and sealed. With water cooled bearings. |
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seafeverofcuan <seafeverofcuan@...>
Gary,
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I replaced the original freshwater pump with a Whale Fresh IC FW50848 it has given excellent service for three years,on strength of this when the bilge pump failed yet again, I replaced that with a Whale macerator pump. Not so quiet but less amps and faster disposal. Vetus make similar pumps to Reya at a fraction of the cost. Regards, Trevor Lusty Ps I chose Whale because they are manufactured 20 miles from where I live in Northern Ireland SeaFever of Cuan No 425 Mexcio --- In amelyachtowners@..., amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:
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Martin <yachtcaduceus@...>
An interesting amount of material in this thread. I dcided to stick with what I had and as stated in previous posts fitted a new accumulator only to find that the pressure switch appeared to have failed. The web link given helped identify this as I could not get the pump to cut in unless the pressure dropped to zero.
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Today I acquire a Square D Pressure switch from a local plumbers merchant at $23.00, which seemed a be a bargain. This is the 20-40 psi version and is identical to the original fitted by Amel including the thread. The only adjustment required was to drop the range to 15-35psi, using the large nut as described in the web link, which is approximately where Amel set the original. The pump struggles to get to 40psi. This info may of use to someone. Regards, Martin Bevan Caduceus Amel 54 #56 Annapolis, USA --- In amelyachtowners@..., amelliahona <no_reply@...> wrote:
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