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[Amel] Danny-Staysail

Danny and Yvonne SIMMS #13263 Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@...> To: amelyachtowners@... Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Sailorman <kimberlite@...> #13264 Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@... <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan!
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Alan Leslie #13265 Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 toggle quoted message Show quoted text --- In amelyachtowners@..., Sailorman <kimberlite@...> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@... <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan! 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Danny and Yvonne SIMMS #13266 Hi Eric, sorry for the confusion. Forwad of the mainmast it would not be a mizzen stay sail I guess Danny ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@...> To: amelyachtowners@... Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:33 PM Subject: RE: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups..com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups..com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Sailorman <kimberlite@...> #13267 Hey Danny No problem, we are all family here Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 3:07 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, sorry for the confusion. Forwad of the mainmast it would not be a mizzen stay sail I guess Danny ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@... <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:33 PM Subject: RE: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups..com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups..com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan!
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Sailorman <kimberlite@...> #13268 Alan, Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@...> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@... <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan!
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Alan Leslie #13269 No problem Eric...but you'll have to wait a bit. I'm in Australia and won't be back on the boat until July 4. Elyse is in Port Vila. BUT, I'll take pictures of all the parts and post them then. Cheers Alan toggle quoted message Show quoted text --- In amelyachtowners@..., Sailorman <kimberlite@...> wrote: Alan, Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@ <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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amelforme #13270 Hi Alan. I remember the commotion this boat caused while it was being built. As you know, it was done right and the engineering is to Amel standards so you probably have not had any collateral challenges to other areas because of this modification, no? Can you please give all of us your 'unvarnished' opinion on the true utility of this system and if it is worth it to you regarding safety/performance/utility/compromises/value given the way you use your boat. I am very interested in your valued observations in this regard. Thanks for your consideration. All the best, Joel Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist, LLC Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas Mailing Address: 401 East Las Olas Boulevard #130-126 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301 Phone: (954) 462-5869 Cell: (954) 812-2485 Email: jfpottercys@... From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 4:54 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail No problem Eric...but you'll have to wait a bit. I'm in Australia and won't be back on the boat until July 4. Elyse is in Port Vila. BUT, I'll take pictures of all the parts and post them then. Cheers Alan --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@...> wrote: Alan, Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@ <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com%20%3cmailto:bob%40bourlet.com> <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan!
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Alan Leslie #13275 Hi Joel, In the last 4 years Elyse has done some 15,000 miles of real blue water sailing across the atlantic, panama into the pacific and on to New Caledonia without any rig problems at all, apart from blowing out the main in Vanuatu in 2012...but that was skipper error. To have a smaller headsail that can be used full out and being able to sheet the staysail inside the shrouds really improves the boat's ability to go to windward...not that we want to do that, but at times its necessary. (vertically battened main and mizzen help also) When I went to look at this boat, the staysail rig was the first thing I looked at. I'd seen others that had a furler or magaziner tied to the fwd mooring cleat which I don't consider seamen-like at all and if it had been like that I wouldn't have bought it. This rig, however, is very strong and with the dyneema runners, the inner forestay loads are well balanced. I would have no hesitation using the staysail in serious up wind conditions. I would be interested to know more about the "commotion" you speak of. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 toggle quoted message Show quoted text --- In amelyachtowners@..., "Joel F Potter" <jfpottercys@...> wrote: Hi Alan. I remember the commotion this boat caused while it was being built. As you know, it was done right and the engineering is to Amel standards so you probably have not had any collateral challenges to other areas because of this modification, no? Can you please give all of us your 'unvarnished' opinion on the true utility of this system and if it is worth it to you regarding safety/performance/utility/compromises/value given the way you use your boat. I am very interested in your valued observations in this regard. Thanks for your consideration. All the best, Joel Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist, LLC Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas Mailing Address: 401 East Las Olas Boulevard #130-126 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301 Phone: (954) 462-5869 Cell: (954) 812-2485 Email: jfpottercys@... From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 4:54 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail No problem Eric...but you'll have to wait a bit. I'm in Australia and won't be back on the boat until July 4. Elyse is in Port Vila. BUT, I'll take pictures of all the parts and post them then. Cheers Alan --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Alan, Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@ <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com%20%3cmailto:bob%40bourlet.com> <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan! 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Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...> #13277 Hello Alan, I have a stay sail as well. The previous owner was very knowledgeable, I need to call him back, I really like the way it was installed, therefore I have not quite yet master that stay sail... Just as you said, I have put the sheets inside the shroud, etc. but I have obtain better result (to sail close to the wind) by partially unfurling the genoa inside the shroud as well. I obtain 55 degree, below that loosing speed. How close can you sail to the wind with yours? Sincerely, Alexandre SM2K #289 NIKIMAT Seabrook - Texas - USA toggle quoted message Show quoted text --- On Sat, 6/15/13, alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k <divanz620@...> wrote: From: alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k <divanz620@...> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail To: amelyachtowners@... Date: Saturday, June 15, 2013, 6:51 PM Hi Joel, In the last 4 years Elyse has done some 15,000 miles of real blue water sailing across the atlantic, panama into the pacific and on to New Caledonia without any rig problems at all, apart from blowing out the main in Vanuatu in 2012...but that was skipper error. To have a smaller headsail that can be used full out and being able to sheet the staysail inside the shrouds really improves the boat's ability to go to windward...not that we want to do that, but at times its necessary. (vertically battened main and mizzen help also) When I went to look at this boat, the staysail rig was the first thing I looked at. I'd seen others that had a furler or magaziner tied to the fwd mooring cleat which I don't consider seamen-like at all and if it had been like that I wouldn't have bought it. This rig, however, is very strong and with the dyneema runners, the inner forestay loads are well balanced. I would have no hesitation using the staysail in serious up wind conditions. I would be interested to know more about the "commotion" you speak of. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@..., "Joel F Potter" <jfpottercys@...> wrote: Hi Alan. I remember the commotion this boat caused while it was being built. As you know, it was done right and the engineering is to Amel standards so you probably have not had any collateral challenges to other areas because of this modification, no? Can you please give all of us your 'unvarnished' opinion on the true utility of this system and if it is worth it to you regarding safety/performance/utility/compromises/value given the way you use your boat. I am very interested in your valued observations in this regard. Thanks for your consideration. All the best, Joel Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist, LLC Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas Mailing Address: 401 East Las Olas Boulevard #130-126 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301 Phone: (954) 462-5869 Cell: (954) 812-2485 Email: jfpottercys@... From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 4:54 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail No problem Eric...but you'll have to wait a bit. I'm in Australia and won't be back on the boat until July 4. Elyse is in Port Vila. BUT, I'll take pictures of all the parts and post them then. Cheers Alan --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Alan, Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@ <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com%20%3cmailto:bob%40bourlet.com> <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan! 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Alan Leslie #13278 Hi Alexandre, If we go to weather in anything above 15 knots true, I use the staysail inside the shrouds. I don't partially furl the genoa going to windward, the shape is not good and the sheeting angles are difficult. The totally unrolled staysail has a much better shape, and the centre of effort is closer to the centre of the boat so the bow doesn't get pulled off as much as with the genoa (less weather helm) Going hard to weather with the staysail in tight and the main traveller up to weather we can usually make better than 50 degrees depending on the sea state. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 toggle quoted message Show quoted text --- In amelyachtowners@..., Alexandre Uster von Baar <uster@...> wrote: Hello Alan, Â I have a stay sail as well.Â The previous owner was very knowledgeable, I need to call him back,Â I really like the way it was installed, therefore I have not quite yet master that stay sail... Just as you said, I have put the sheets inside the shroud, etc. but I have obtain better result (to sail close to the wind) by partially unfurling the genoa inside the shroud as well.Â I obtain 55 degree, below that loosing speed. How close can you sail to the wind with yours?Â Sincerely, Alexandre SM2K #289 NIKIMAT Seabrook - Texas - USA --- On Sat, 6/15/13, alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k <divanz620@...> wrote: From: alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k <divanz620@...> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail To: amelyachtowners@... Date: Saturday, June 15, 2013, 6:51 PM Â Hi Joel, In the last 4 years Elyse has done some 15,000 miles of real blue water sailing across the atlantic, panama into the pacific and on to New Caledonia without any rig problems at all, apart from blowing out the main in Vanuatu in 2012...but that was skipper error. To have a smaller headsail that can be used full out and being able to sheet the staysail inside the shrouds really improves the boat's ability to go to windward...not that we want to do that, but at times its necessary. (vertically battened main and mizzen help also) When I went to look at this boat, the staysail rig was the first thing I looked at. I'd seen others that had a furler or magaziner tied to the fwd mooring cleat which I don't consider seamen-like at all and if it had been like that I wouldn't have bought it. This rig, however, is very strong and with the dyneema runners, the inner forestay loads are well balanced. I would have no hesitation using the staysail in serious up wind conditions. I would be interested to know more about the "commotion" you speak of. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@..., "Joel F Potter" <jfpottercys@> wrote: Hi Alan. I remember the commotion this boat caused while it was being built. As you know, it was done right and the engineering is to Amel standards so you probably have not had any collateral challenges to other areas because of this modification, no? Can you please give all of us your 'unvarnished' opinion on the true utility of this system and if it is worth it to you regarding safety/performance/utility/compromises/value given the way you use your boat. I am very interested in your valued observations in this regard. Thanks for your consideration. All the best, Joel Joel F. Potter - Cruising Yacht Specialist, LLC Amel's Sole Associate for the Americas Mailing Address: 401 East Las Olas Boulevard #130-126 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301 Phone: (954) 462-5869 Cell: (954) 812-2485 Email: jfpottercys@ From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 4:54 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail No problem Eric...but you'll have to wait a bit. I'm in Australia and won't be back on the boat until July 4. Elyse is in Port Vila. BUT, I'll take pictures of all the parts and post them then. Cheers Alan --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Alan, Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted together. The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to the chain plates when not used. The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the cleat" forestay versions I've seen. Cheers Alan Elyse SM437 --- In amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> , Sailorman <kimberlite@> wrote: Hi Danny, At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. Fair Winds Eric _____ From: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Eric, The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag stays on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag when dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there is a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately later. To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) through to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails we must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward than true. Regards Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji ________________________________ From: Sailorman <kimberlite@ <mailto:kimberlite%40optonline.net> > To: amelyachtowners@... <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail Hi Danny, You mention you have a staysail. How is it rigged. Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite _____ From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of your kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried 4 sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed and then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the boat just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time in the world to sort it out. The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the eye.) Danny SM 299 Ocean Pearl Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji ________________________________ From: minaxi53 <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com%20%3cmailto:bob%40bourlet.com> <mailto:bob%40bourlet.com> > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com <mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM Subject: [Amel] Wind vane Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have heard some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or Monitor systems. Thoughts? Bob s/v Minaxi sm6 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] _____ I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> . SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. Do you have a slow PC? <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> Try a free scan! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Sailorman <kimberlite@...> #15680 Hi, Did you ever have an opportunity to take more photos of the under deck support, the attachment of the stay to the mast and the attachments of the runners? A sketch would be helpful. How is it working? How did they bolt the attachments to the mast? In addition, what halyard do you use for this sail? Fair Winds Eric Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 4:54 AM To: amelyachtowners@... Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail No problem Eric...but you'll have to wait a bit. I'm in Australia and won't be back on the boat until July 4. Elyse is in Port Vila. BUT, I'll take pictures of all the parts and post them then. Cheers Alan --- In amelyachtowners@..., Sailorman wrote: > > Alan, > > Thank you so much for the photos. I would really appreciate seeing more > photos or a sketch of this setup especially the mast fittings, the forward > under deck plate and its attachment, and the runners attached. > > This is exactly what I want to add to Kimberlite. > > Fair Winds > > Eric > > Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite > > > > > > > > _____ > > From: amelyachtowners@... > [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of alan_leslie_elyes_sm2k > Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 2:22 AM > To: amelyachtowners@... > Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail > > > > > > Hi Eric, > > I just posted 2 pics in a new folder called Elyse. > > Elyse has a furler on an inner forestay that was installed at the factory. > > The deck fitting is through bolted to a massive 12mm thick stainless plate > that runs under the foredeck and under the bow fitting...all bolted > together. > > The furler you can see is a manual and the mast attachment is just above the > second spreader...there are running backstays (dyneema) attached to tangs at > the same level coming down to a block and then polyester 2:1 lead off to the > secondary winches in the cockpit. They're stowed with a block and tackle to > the chain plates when not used. > > The sail itself is a reasonably heavy jib with no overlap. It can be sheeted > inside the shrouds with a snatch block attached to the chain plates and the > sheet then run through the genoa blocks on the traveller. > > It works well and is infinitely more secure and strong than the "tied to the > cleat" forestay versions I've seen. > > Cheers > Alan > Elyse SM437 > --- In amelyachtowners@... > , Sailorman > wrote: > > > > Hi Danny, > > > > At the factory they called that the mizzen ballooner. > > > > I thought you had a staysail running forward of the main mast. > > > > Fair Winds > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: amelyachtowners@... > > > [mailto:amelyachtowners@... > ] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne > SIMMS > > Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 1:11 AM > > To: amelyachtowners@... > > > Subject: Re: [Amel] Danny-Staysail > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Eric, > > The stay-sail halyard goes to the top of the mizzen mast. The tack of the > > sail is secures to a ring bolt in the deck about 600mm ahead of the > > windscreen. The tack of the sail is secured to about 1m (3 feet) of rope > > that shackles to the ring bolt. The sail is contained in a bag out of the > > bottom of which comes the staysail tack line. This means that the bag > stays > > on the deck when it is flying and is easy to return the sail to the bag > when > > dropping. Between the last two life line stanchions aft on the rail there > is > > a ring bolt. We attach a block to that that the sheet passes out side the > > rail and then through the block, and then through a block atached to the > > next stanchion forard and then to the small sheet winch on the cockpit > > coming. Our stay sail is a similar material to the headsail balooner. > > To hoist. Run the sheet through its blocks and over the mainsheet. Secure > > the halyard and sheet to the hoist and clew respectively. Haul the halyard > > before sheeting in other wise it is too hard to hoist. Once fully hoisted > > sheet in. When hoisting have the main well out and adjust it appropriately > > later. > > To drop. One person on the deck by the tack to gather, another on the > > halyard (with its tail secured). Leave the sheet on (very important if you > > want a trouble free drop) and just let the halyard fly, totally free. The > > deck person as the load comes off the sail gathers and once half in begin > > stufing into bag. At this time and no sooner release the sheet. > > Our stay sail was made by the US company Mack Sails. > > You can use the staysail from 90 degrees apparent (light winds only) > through > > to 110 degrees apparent.(This can be as much as 130 true)The stronger the > > wind the further aft the apparent wind angle can be. With reaching sails > we > > must always use apparent wind angles as this can be a lot further forward > > than true. > > Regards > > Danny > > SM 299 Ocean Pearl > > Currently arrived Vuda Point marina Fiji > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Sailorman > > > > > To: amelyachtowners@... > > > > > Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 4:26 PM > > Subject: [Amel] Danny-Staysail > > > > > > Hi Danny, > > > > You mention you have a staysail. > > > > How is it rigged. > > > > Fair Winds > > > > Eric > > > > Amel Super Maramu #376 Kimberlite > > > > _____ > > > > From: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny and > > Yvonne SIMMS > > Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2013 12:09 AM > > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [Amel] Wind vane > > > > Hi Bob, good to see your name popping up on the site. Happy memories of > your > > kindness to strangers when we met at Oyster Bay in 2009. > > Recently spent some time with Cameron Murray in Opua. > > As to wind vane. Totally unessesary I believe. We have a Raymarine auto > > pilot with a steer to wind option. We just did a run from NZ to Fiji in 10 > > to 20 knot winds on a broad reach.(max was 27) Most of the way we carried > 4 > > sails (Headsail, main, mizzen staysail, mizzen) Only reduced if conditions > > became or threatened to be squally. All the way we had the pilot on wind > > steer. Wonderfull. The wind direction oscilated off the mean by up to 20 > > degrees either side. The boat just followed the wind, no trimming needed > and > > then the oscilation brought her back to the average course we needed. The > > beaty of off shore sailing is the distances are so great you can wait for > > the wind to shift, and it will to a surprising degree, and you do not have > > to pendantically hold to a course. Any way we are sold on the wind steer > > option. One night a squall came through with a 90 degree shift and the > boat > > just followed it, no back winding or gybes. Marvelous. Had all the time > > in the world to sort it out. > > The trip took us 7 days, the wind was just a bit far aft of the beam for > > best speed, particularly when it was only 10 knots. > > On other voyages we have found the steer to wind just as effective on all > > points of sailing, including to windward. (to windward you need to lay off > > slightly to give it time to respond before the wind get too close to the > > eye.) > > Danny > > SM 299 Ocean Pearl > > Currently arrived Vuda Point Marina Fiji > > > > ________________________________ > > From: minaxi53 > > > To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com > > > > Sent: Saturday, 15 June 2013 5:23 AM > > Subject: [Amel] Wind vane > > > > Has any SM owner fitted a windvane for ocean passages? If so what make? > > I am considering making this addition before my next passage but have > heard > > some reports that certain boats do not respond well to either Hydrvane or > > Monitor systems. Thoughts? > > Bob > > s/v Minaxi sm6 > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > I am using the Free version of SPAMfighter > <http://www.spamfighter.com/len> > > . > > SPAMfighter has removed 1569 of my spam emails to date. > > > > Do you have a slow PC? > <http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen> > > Try a free scan! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
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Alan Leslie #15688 Hi Eric, Your posts always come through as "no subject", "no author"......no wa y to know what they are about, o who they're from until opened ! Yes I took photos and posted them in an album Elyse Staysail I think its called. There is an additional halyard for the staysail that comes out of the mast just above the spreader. The runner attachments are standard tangs bolted on to the mast. I think the pictures tell the story....if you want more specific pics let me know..I'm on the boat for the next two weeks. Cheers Alan SV Elyse SM437
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