Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger, much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time to visit for the novice. 


________________________________


 


John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb. We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is. Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000 miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby" <annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.
Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Respectfully, Stephen Hancock, I disagree.

First of all, when discussing the degree of safety & security, anyone using any analysis compares the known or familiar to the unknown. It is a logical process. As far as I know, there is no place that is totally safe, therefore, degrees of safety.

Secondly, to then continue your argument with a "comparison" of Islamist Arab radicals in Egypt who want more religion in their government to non-Arab Muslims in Turkey who are protesting for less religion in government, contradicts your first premise which was against comparing Chicago to Turkey.

We arrived in Turkey in April 2011. How long have you been there? Where are you? We should meet and compare information.

Oh, and by the way, there is no way we would have considered Egypt in 2011-current time...and we will not cruise Israel...possibly you can understand our decision process.

We are going to be cruising Turkey this summer with our pre-teen granddaughter, "BeBe." Now you know where the name of the boat came from. We have been touring the world for the last seven plus years. I am constantly amazed how intelligent people react to news that has been twisted to make a headline, or gain a "click."

All of the above is my opinion, based on my experience and research. I believe that each person should make decisions based on the best information available.

Selfishly, I hope that some sailors stay away from Turkey...it was a little crowded last season.

Best,

Bill
BeBe, SM2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

Hi John & Bill,
 
Let's not get carried away.  It's safer visiting Turkey than a lot of cities around the world - but we still go to them!
 
For good advice visit the UK FCO website.  The link for Turkey is: https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/turkey
 
Regards
 
Mike
 
Solitude
 
SM2K #461
 
 
 

From: Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...>
To: "amelyachtowners@..." <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 15:06
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey

 
Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger, much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time to visit for the novice. 


________________________________


 


John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb. We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is. Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000 miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby" <annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.
Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I agree that Turkey is a more European country then Egypt but to tell someone it is safe without knowing what to expect is a bit to much.  My point was that unless this area is very familiar to some one they must take precautions beyond someone with your experience. Maybe a guide.  These are great people with a great culture but unless you know the area then you are taking a chance. Also ask the Armenians if the Turks are always non violent.  You seem the think that we are all as worldly as you. I only wish it were so.  I would feel more safe there then most American big cities if I knew what you evidently know. " Cannons to the right, onward rode the light brigade"


________________________________


 

Respectfully, Stephen Hancock, I disagree.

First of all, when discussing the degree of safety & security, anyone using any analysis compares the known or familiar to the unknown. It is a logical process. As far as I know, there is no place that is totally safe, therefore, degrees of safety.

Secondly, to then continue your argument with a "comparison" of Islamist Arab radicals in Egypt who want more religion in their government to non-Arab Muslims in Turkey who are protesting for less religion in government, contradicts your first premise which was against comparing Chicago to Turkey.

We arrived in Turkey in April 2011. How long have you been there? Where are you? We should meet and compare information.

Oh, and by the way, there is no way we would have considered Egypt in 2011-current time...and we will not cruise Israel...possibly you can understand our decision process.

We are going to be cruising Turkey this summer with our pre-teen granddaughter, "BeBe." Now you know where the name of the boat came from. We have been touring the world for the last seven plus years. I am constantly amazed how intelligent people react to news that has been twisted to make a headline, or gain a "click."

All of the above is my opinion, based on my experience and research. I believe that each person should make decisions based on the best information available.

Selfishly, I hope that some sailors stay away from Turkey...it was a little crowded last season.

Best,

Bill
BeBe, SM2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

Hi,
 
Bill is absolutely correct.  In essence it is for each individual to make their own assessment of the risks based on reputable sources of information and their own degree of experience.  Having made the choice it is incumbent on us to remain 'street wise' and ensure we are not exposed to unnecessary risks beyond what is normal in day to day life.
 
Don't be fooled by the camera lens narrow field of view - reporters are selling stories and tranquillity never gets good audience figures on 24 hour news channels!
 
Mike
 
Solitude
SM2K #461

From: Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...>
To: "amelyachtowners@..." <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 18:05
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey

 
I agree that Turkey is a more European country then Egypt but to tell someone it is safe without knowing what to expect is a bit to much.  My point was that unless this area is very familiar to some one they must take precautions beyond someone with your experience. Maybe a guide.  These are great people with a great culture but unless you know the area then you are taking a chance. Also ask the Armenians if the Turks are always non violent.  You seem the think that we are all as worldly as you. I only wish it were so.  I would feel more safe there then most American big cities if I knew what you evidently know. " Cannons to the right, onward rode the light brigade"


________________________________


 

Respectfully, Stephen Hancock, I disagree.

First of all, when discussing the degree of safety & security, anyone using any analysis compares the known or familiar to the unknown. It is a logical process. As far as I know, there is no place that is totally safe, therefore, degrees of safety.

Secondly, to then continue your argument with a "comparison" of Islamist Arab radicals in Egypt who want more religion in their government to non-Arab Muslims in Turkey who are protesting for less religion in government, contradicts your first premise which was against comparing Chicago to Turkey.

We arrived in Turkey in April 2011. How long have you been there? Where are you? We should meet and compare information.

Oh, and by the way, there is no way we would have considered Egypt in 2011-current time...and we will not cruise Israel...possibly you can understand our decision process.

We are going to be cruising Turkey this summer with our pre-teen granddaughter, "BeBe." Now you know where the name of the boat came from. We have been touring the world for the last seven plus years. I am constantly amazed how intelligent people react to news that has been twisted to make a headline, or gain a "click."

All of the above is my opinion, based on my experience and research. I believe that each person should make decisions based on the best information available.

Selfishly, I hope that some sailors stay away from Turkey...it was a little crowded last season.

Best,

Bill
BeBe, SM2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...> wrote:

Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger, much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time to visit for the novice. 


________________________________


 


John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb. We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is. Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000 miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby" <annejohnholl@> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.
Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello Bill, The news that was forwarded to me was from a leading Turkish sailor and on rereading it it does not talk directly of danger to tourists but of a seriously deteriorating situation. I would not have written to you if I had known that you have not actually been in Turkey for the past six months and I would not have used this forum if I had been able to find your address which Yahoo seems to protect assiduously.
It seems to me that the views of people like me who have been to Turkey in recent years are pretty irrelevant in the fast changing situation and I hope that there will be no more messages except from people actually in the country or in touch with people who are.

Best wishes, John, Bali Hai, SM 319, Malta

From: Judy and Bill aboard SV BeBe
Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 6:09 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Respectfully, Stephen Hancock, I disagree.

First of all, when discussing the degree of safety & security, anyone using any analysis compares the known or familiar to the unknown. It is a logical process. As far as I know, there is no place that is totally safe, therefore, degrees of safety.

Secondly, to then continue your argument with a "comparison" of Islamist Arab radicals in Egypt who want more religion in their government to non-Arab Muslims in Turkey who are protesting for less religion in government, contradicts your first premise which was against comparing Chicago to Turkey.

We arrived in Turkey in April 2011. How long have you been there? Where are you? We should meet and compare information.

Oh, and by the way, there is no way we would have considered Egypt in 2011-current time...and we will not cruise Israel...possibly you can understand our decision process.

We are going to be cruising Turkey this summer with our pre-teen granddaughter, "BeBe." Now you know where the name of the boat came from. We have been touring the world for the last seven plus years. I am constantly amazed how intelligent people react to news that has been twisted to make a headline, or gain a "click."

All of the above is my opinion, based on my experience and research. I believe that each person should make decisions based on the best information available.

Selfishly, I hope that some sailors stay away from Turkey...it was a little crowded last season.

Best,

Bill
BeBe, SM2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...> wrote:

Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger, much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time to visit for the novice.Â


________________________________


Â


John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb. We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is. Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000 miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby" <annejohnholl@> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.
Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

John,
We also received the same email from that leading Turkish sailor and at first thought it was alarming. But we also are in contact with several cruising sailors most of whom have been in Turkey for at least 2 years. No one has reported any problems whatsoever. We also are in email and phone contact with several Turkish friends living in towns of less than 100,000 population and they also report no problems to date. We all understand what is happening politically in Turkey and realize that it is a fluid situation. We would not be bringing our pre-teen granddaughter to spend the summer sailing with us in Turkey if we felt there was any danger. If someone uses common sense and avoids demonstrations there should be no problem. The economy of Turkey relies heavily on tourism and does not want to kill that golden goose.

Judy
S/V BeBe

Hello Judy, Thanks for that reassuring info. John SM319 Bali Hai

From: Judy and Bill aboard SV BeBe
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 5:20 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


John,
We also received the same email from that leading Turkish sailor and at first thought it was alarming. But we also are in contact with several cruising sailors most of whom have been in Turkey for at least 2 years. No one has reported any problems whatsoever. We also are in email and phone contact with several Turkish friends living in towns of less than 100,000 population and they also report no problems to date. We all understand what is happening politically in Turkey and realize that it is a fluid situation. We would not be bringing our pre-teen granddaughter to spend the summer sailing with us in Turkey if we felt there was any danger. If someone uses common sense and avoids demonstrations there should be no problem. The economy of Turkey relies heavily on tourism and does not want to kill that golden goose.

Judy
S/V BeBe

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "Anne and John Hollamby " <annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill, The news that was forwarded to me was from a leading Turkish sailor and on rereading it it does not talk directly of danger to tourists but of a seriously deteriorating situation. I would not have written to you if I had known that you have not actually been in Turkey for the past six months and I would not have used this forum if I had been able to find your address which Yahoo seems to protect assiduously.
It seems to me that the views of people like me who have been to Turkey in recent years are pretty irrelevant in the fast changing situation and I hope that there will be no more messages except from people actually in the country or in touch with people who are.

Best wishes, John, Bali Hai, SM 319, Malta

From: Judy and Bill aboard SV BeBe
Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 6:09 PM
To: mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Respectfully, Stephen Hancock, I disagree.

First of all, when discussing the degree of safety & security, anyone using any analysis compares the known or familiar to the unknown. It is a logical process. As far as I know, there is no place that is totally safe, therefore, degrees of safety.

Secondly, to then continue your argument with a "comparison" of Islamist Arab radicals in Egypt who want more religion in their government to non-Arab Muslims in Turkey who are protesting for less religion in government, contradicts your first premise which was against comparing Chicago to Turkey.

We arrived in Turkey in April 2011. How long have you been there? Where are you? We should meet and compare information.

Oh, and by the way, there is no way we would have considered Egypt in 2011-current time...and we will not cruise Israel...possibly you can understand our decision process.

We are going to be cruising Turkey this summer with our pre-teen granddaughter, "BeBe." Now you know where the name of the boat came from. We have been touring the world for the last seven plus years. I am constantly amazed how intelligent people react to news that has been twisted to make a headline, or gain a "click."

All of the above is my opinion, based on my experience and research. I believe that each person should make decisions based on the best information available.

Selfishly, I hope that some sailors stay away from Turkey...it was a little crowded last season.

Best,

Bill
BeBe, SM2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@> wrote:

Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger, much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time to visit for the novice.Â


________________________________


Â


John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb. We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is. Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000 miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby" <annejohnholl@> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.
Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I agree with Bill & Mike on this one. Don't be fooled by what you hear
or read in the media. They are a bunch of sensationalists working to get
the most attention by hyping up the reality. I met several Turkish
tourists whilst in Simi and their view was that the situation was more
of an amusement than a threat. One couple even said that it was good to
see the Turkish people expressing their feelings for once.

Whilst I have technically not been in Turkey this summer as I have a pet
on board with an EU only passport, I did overnight in Kekova Roads for
shelter, where everything looked absolutely normal. I don't think that
anyone has anything to worry about near the coast. Maybe a night stroll
through Taksim Square in Istanbul might be unwise, but so was a night
stroll in Barbados in 1970 when I was mugged at knife point!

I remember many years ago when Northern Ireland was all bullets and
bombs (according to the press). I had to go to Belfast to deliver a
yacht to Scotland. With some trepidation I asked my taxi driver to stay
well clear of the troubles. He laughed and said that you would have to
be in about a one square mile area near the Falls Road to have any
likelihood of seeing any action. He was right of course.

I will email an Australian friend who lives right in Taksim Square and
ask her opinion. If it's of value I will post it.

Enjoy Turkey

Ian Shepherd (& baby Siberian Husky Kelly) SM 414 Crusader - Leros Greece

On 24/06/2013 16:16, Mike Johnson wrote:

Hi John & Bill,

Let's not get carried away. It's safer visiting Turkey than a lot of
cities around the world - but we still go to them!

For good advice visit the UK FCO website. The link for Turkey is:
https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/turkey

Regards

Mike

Solitude

SM2K #461




From: Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...
<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>>
To: "amelyachtowners@...
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>"
<amelyachtowners@...
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 15:06
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and
Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to
visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never
sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you
don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger,
much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time
to visit for the novice.

________________________________



John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb.
We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests
are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion
to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular
state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not
unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the
crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before
making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is.
Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000
miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby"
<annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in

Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages
forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would
appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many
are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.

Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey

this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Ian
Where on Leros are you? We are in Xerokambos.

Possible to have an Amel union?

/Ann-Sofie & Jonas
SM 232, S/Y Lady Annila


Skickat från min iPad

26 jun 2013 kl. 15:52 skrev "Ian Shepherd" <sv_freespirit@...>:

Further to my last, I have received the following from my friend Roz who
lives in the centre of Istanbul:


"As to the riots, life here in Istanbul is pretty normal, people
generally avoid Taksim if they aren't protesting. I'm over that way
every day and just try to get out of there by 5pm. So feel safe by
coming here. I will let u know if it gets worse. I'm flat out at the
moment travelling all over Turkey doing exams and can't see myself
having a holiday until Aug for a week then a month in Oct, but not
complaining, its work!!"

So as you can see, apart from Taksim Square in the centre of Istanbul,
it's all a storm in a teacup.

Regards

Ian Shepherd SM2000 414 Crusader - Dodecanese

On 26/06/2013 12:52, Ian Shepherd wrote:

I agree with Bill & Mike on this one. Don't be fooled by what you hear
or read in the media. They are a bunch of sensationalists working to get
the most attention by hyping up the reality. I met several Turkish
tourists whilst in Simi and their view was that the situation was more
of an amusement than a threat. One couple even said that it was good to
see the Turkish people expressing their feelings for once.

Whilst I have technically not been in Turkey this summer as I have a pet
on board with an EU only passport, I did overnight in Kekova Roads for
shelter, where everything looked absolutely normal. I don't think that
anyone has anything to worry about near the coast. Maybe a night stroll
through Taksim Square in Istanbul might be unwise, but so was a night
stroll in Barbados in 1970 when I was mugged at knife point!

I remember many years ago when Northern Ireland was all bullets and
bombs (according to the press). I had to go to Belfast to deliver a
yacht to Scotland. With some trepidation I asked my taxi driver to stay
well clear of the troubles. He laughed and said that you would have to
be in about a one square mile area near the Falls Road to have any
likelihood of seeing any action. He was right of course.

I will email an Australian friend who lives right in Taksim Square and
ask her opinion. If it's of value I will post it.

Enjoy Turkey

Ian Shepherd (& baby Siberian Husky Kelly) SM 414 Crusader - Leros Greece

On 24/06/2013 16:16, Mike Johnson wrote:

Hi John & Bill,

Let's not get carried away. It's safer visiting Turkey than a lot of
cities around the world - but we still go to them!

For good advice visit the UK FCO website. The link for Turkey is:
https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/turkey

Regards

Mike

Solitude

SM2K #461




From: Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...

<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>

<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>>
To: "amelyachtowners@...

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>"
<amelyachtowners@...

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 15:06
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and
Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to
visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never
sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you
don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger,
much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time
to visit for the novice.

________________________________



John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb.
We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests
are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion
to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular
state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not
unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the
crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before
making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is.
Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000
miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby"
<annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in

Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages
forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would
appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many
are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an

Islamic one.

Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey

this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The Turks can be violent, ask the Armenians. There are places in every country including the good old USA that look good but are in fact not safe. It requires more then a simple, it is safe others just sensationalize it, as a problem. Maybe call your embassy before you travel to any area. The Turkish culture is more European but still people of opportunity can ruin your day or life. Don't just take anyone's advice without personnel research. People are bias because the have had no trouble. As far as asking someone that loves their country their are truly bias. Travels in any country are targets. 


________________________________

 

Hi Ian
Where on Leros are you? We are in Xerokambos.

Possible to have an Amel union?

/Ann-Sofie & Jonas
SM 232, S/Y Lady Annila


Skickat från min iPad

26 jun 2013 kl. 15:52 skrev "Ian Shepherd" <mailto:sv_freespirit%40yahoo.co.uk>:

I agree with Bill & Mike on this one. Don't be fooled by what you hear
or read in the media. They are a bunch of sensationalists working to get
the most attention by hyping up the reality. I met several Turkish
tourists whilst in Simi and their view was that the situation was more
of an amusement than a threat. One couple even said that it was good to
see the Turkish people expressing their feelings for once.

Whilst I have technically not been in Turkey this summer as I have a pet
on board with an EU only passport, I did overnight in Kekova Roads for
shelter, where everything looked absolutely normal. I don't think that
anyone has anything to worry about near the coast. Maybe a night stroll
through Taksim Square in Istanbul might be unwise, but so was a night
stroll in Barbados in 1970 when I was mugged at knife point!

I remember many years ago when Northern Ireland was all bullets and
bombs (according to the press). I had to go to Belfast to deliver a
yacht to Scotland. With some trepidation I asked my taxi driver to stay
well clear of the troubles. He laughed and said that you would have to
be in about a one square mile area near the Falls Road to have any
likelihood of seeing any action. He was right of course.

I will email an Australian friend who lives right in Taksim Square and
ask her opinion. If it's of value I will post it.

Enjoy Turkey

Ian Shepherd (& baby Siberian Husky Kelly) SM 414 Crusader - Leros Greece

On 24/06/2013 16:16, Mike Johnson wrote:

Hi John & Bill,

Let's not get carried away. It's safer visiting Turkey than a lot of
cities around the world - but we still go to them!

For good advice visit the UK FCO website. The link for Turkey is:
https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/turkey

Regards

Mike

Solitude

SM2K #461




From: Yahoo! Mail <mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com
<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>>
To: "mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>"
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 15:06
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and
Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to
visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never
sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you
don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger,
much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time
to visit for the novice.

________________________________



John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb.
We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests
are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion
to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular
state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are not
unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the
crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before
making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is.
Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000
miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby"
<annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in

Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages
forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would
appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many
are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an Islamic one.

Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to Turkey

this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Ann-Sofie & Jonas,

I am anchored in Patheni Bay near Agmar marine. I am a bit disabled at
the moment as my port side genoa car failed yesterday and I will have to
stay here till I get a new one. If you are headed north, then please
drop by. It is always good to meet other Amel owners. If I can jury rig
the car, I might be able to make it to Lakki.

Best wishes

Ian Shepherd SM 414 Crusader Tel: +357-99642701

On 27/06/2013 05:07, Ann-Sofie Svanberg wrote:

Hi Ian
Where on Leros are you? We are in Xerokambos.

Possible to have an Amel union?

/Ann-Sofie & Jonas
SM 232, S/Y Lady Annila


Skickat från min iPad

26 jun 2013 kl. 15:52 skrev "Ian Shepherd" <sv_freespirit@...
<mailto:sv_freespirit%40yahoo.co.uk>>:

I agree with Bill & Mike on this one. Don't be fooled by what you hear
or read in the media. They are a bunch of sensationalists working to

get

the most attention by hyping up the reality. I met several Turkish
tourists whilst in Simi and their view was that the situation was more
of an amusement than a threat. One couple even said that it was good to
see the Turkish people expressing their feelings for once.

Whilst I have technically not been in Turkey this summer as I have a

pet

on board with an EU only passport, I did overnight in Kekova Roads for
shelter, where everything looked absolutely normal. I don't think that
anyone has anything to worry about near the coast. Maybe a night stroll
through Taksim Square in Istanbul might be unwise, but so was a night
stroll in Barbados in 1970 when I was mugged at knife point!

I remember many years ago when Northern Ireland was all bullets and
bombs (according to the press). I had to go to Belfast to deliver a
yacht to Scotland. With some trepidation I asked my taxi driver to stay
well clear of the troubles. He laughed and said that you would have to
be in about a one square mile area near the Falls Road to have any
likelihood of seeing any action. He was right of course.

I will email an Australian friend who lives right in Taksim Square and
ask her opinion. If it's of value I will post it.

Enjoy Turkey

Ian Shepherd (& baby Siberian Husky Kelly) SM 414 Crusader - Leros

Greece

On 24/06/2013 16:16, Mike Johnson wrote:

Hi John & Bill,

Let's not get carried away. It's safer visiting Turkey than a lot of
cities around the world - but we still go to them!

For good advice visit the UK FCO website. The link for Turkey is:
https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/turkey

Regards

Mike

Solitude

SM2K #461




From: Yahoo! Mail <sammie.whammie@...

<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>

<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>>
To: "amelyachtowners@...

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>"
<amelyachtowners@...

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 15:06
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and
Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to
visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never
sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you
don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger,
much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time
to visit for the novice.

________________________________



John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb.
We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests
are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion
to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular
state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are

not

unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the
crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before
making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is.
Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000
miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby"
<annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in

Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages
forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would
appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many
are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an

Islamic one.

Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to

Turkey

this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sammie,

with respect, I think you are being somewhat paranoid. I have cruised
Turkey on and off since the 80's. In my opinion the Turks I have met are
lovely helpful people. As has been said elsewhere, tourism is important
to them and they are not going to throw that away. In days gone by, the
Turks were indeed fearful warriors. But so were the Greeks. Ask the
Turks. Do I feel unsafe in the Aegean? Of course not. Ask the Red
Indians about the white Americans, ask the the victims of English,
Dutch, Spanish and French colonisation, and you will have to accept that
most of us have a track record of being violent. I think the Armenian's
were slaughtered during the First World War, around 1915. Hardly
relevant to today's situation.

As for Embassy advice, it is quite predictably 'Avoid protest and
demonstrations as they might become violent'. A precaution any sensible
tourist will take anyway.

Time to draw a line under this discussion, though of course we would
love to hear from those who have recently visited Turkey and can provide
us with a truthful reassurance rather than somewhat hysterical
conjecture. If I did not have a dog on board with an EU only passport, I
would be there now.

Ian Shepherd SM2000 414 Crusader - in the Kebab latitudes.

My only reason for commenting on this is to say it is too simple to say there is no problem in this country. Anywhere you go you need to be vigilant.  Americans and tourist are targets in this wide world. Don't listen to people that say no problem. Do research anywhere before you go. If being cautious is paranoid then I am guilty. You sound very defensive and one sided. Discussion is how we learn. If my giving the other side hurts your feelings then I do apologize. I look forward to seeing Turkey again.


________________________________

 

Sammie,

with respect, I think you are being somewhat paranoid. I have cruised
Turkey on and off since the 80's. In my opinion the Turks I have met are
lovely helpful people. As has been said elsewhere, tourism is important
to them and they are not going to throw that away. In days gone by, the
Turks were indeed fearful warriors. But so were the Greeks. Ask the
Turks. Do I feel unsafe in the Aegean? Of course not. Ask the Red
Indians about the white Americans, ask the the victims of English,
Dutch, Spanish and French colonisation, and you will have to accept that
most of us have a track record of being violent. I think the Armenian's
were slaughtered during the First World War, around 1915. Hardly
relevant to today's situation.

As for Embassy advice, it is quite predictably 'Avoid protest and
demonstrations as they might become violent'. A precaution any sensible
tourist will take anyway.

Time to draw a line under this discussion, though of course we would
love to hear from those who have recently visited Turkey and can provide
us with a truthful reassurance rather than somewhat hysterical
conjecture. If I did not have a dog on board with an EU only passport, I
would be there now.

Ian Shepherd SM2000 414 Crusader - in the Kebab latitudes.

On 27/06/2013 13:23, Yahoo! Mail wrote:

The Turks can be violent, ask the Armenians. There are places in every
country including the good old USA that look good but are in fact not
safe. It requires more then a simple, it is safe others just
sensationalize it, as a problem. Maybe call your embassy before you
travel to any area. The Turkish culture is more European but still
people of opportunity can ruin your day or life. Don't just take
anyone's advice without personnel research. People are bias because
the have had no trouble. As far as asking someone that loves their
country their are truly bias. Travels in any country are targets.


________________________________



Hi Ian
Where on Leros are you? We are in Xerokambos.

Possible to have an Amel union?

/Ann-Sofie & Jonas
SM 232, S/Y Lady Annila

Skickat från min iPad

26 jun 2013 kl. 15:52 skrev "Ian Shepherd"
<mailto:sv_freespirit%40yahoo.co.uk>:

I agree with Bill & Mike on this one. Don't be fooled by what you hear
or read in the media. They are a bunch of sensationalists working to

get

the most attention by hyping up the reality. I met several Turkish
tourists whilst in Simi and their view was that the situation was more
of an amusement than a threat. One couple even said that it was good to
see the Turkish people expressing their feelings for once.

Whilst I have technically not been in Turkey this summer as I have a

pet

on board with an EU only passport, I did overnight in Kekova Roads for
shelter, where everything looked absolutely normal. I don't think that
anyone has anything to worry about near the coast. Maybe a night stroll
through Taksim Square in Istanbul might be unwise, but so was a night
stroll in Barbados in 1970 when I was mugged at knife point!

I remember many years ago when Northern Ireland was all bullets and
bombs (according to the press). I had to go to Belfast to deliver a
yacht to Scotland. With some trepidation I asked my taxi driver to stay
well clear of the troubles. He laughed and said that you would have to
be in about a one square mile area near the Falls Road to have any
likelihood of seeing any action. He was right of course.

I will email an Australian friend who lives right in Taksim Square and
ask her opinion. If it's of value I will post it.

Enjoy Turkey

Ian Shepherd (& baby Siberian Husky Kelly) SM 414 Crusader - Leros

Greece

On 24/06/2013 16:16, Mike Johnson wrote:

Hi John & Bill,

Let's not get carried away. It's safer visiting Turkey than a lot of
cities around the world - but we still go to them!

For good advice visit the UK FCO website. The link for Turkey is:
https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/turkey

Regards

Mike

Solitude

SM2K #461




From: Yahoo! Mail <mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com
<mailto:sammie.whammie%40yahoo.com>>
To: "mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>"
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com
<mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com>>
Sent: Monday, 24 June 2013, 15:06
Subject: Re: [Amel] Re: Disturbing messages from Turkey


Just because cities in the U.S. are dangerous, like Chicago and
Detroit does not mean areas in Turkey are worth risking your life to
visit. I heard the same argument about Egypt and now you are never
sure what to expect. Muslim extremists are every where and if you
don't really know the area then you are putting yourself in danger,
much like visiting Detroit. Great culture but now maybe not the time
to visit for the novice.

________________________________



John,

We have been in the US since Dec because of my cancer surgery in Feb.
We return to Gocek on 1 July.

We do not consider things dangerous in Turkey. Remember, the protests
are against the government's conservative swing to add more religion
to government. Ataturk led the revolution which created a secular
state. Most Turks want what Ataturk fought for. These protests are

not

unlike protests against too much government in the US. Look at the
crime and murder rate in Turkey as compared to the US or UK before
making a decision. You will be surprised at how much safer Turkey is.
Also remember that it is very unlikely that you will be wihin 1000
miles of any protest while cruising Turkey.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe, Sm2k, #387
Gocek, Turkey

--- In mailto:amelyachtowners%40yahoogroups.com, "John Hollamby"
<annejohnholl@...> wrote:

Hello Bill and Judy,
I have some friends who were going to spend a few days holiday in

Turkey with their children.I have just received a couple of messages
forwarded from Turks warning about the troubles from which it would
appear that things could get worse not better on the basis that many
are unhappy about the trend away from the secular state to an

Islamic one.

Do you have any views for those who were intending to sail to

Turkey

this season?

Best wishes, Anne and John, Bali Hai, SM319, Malta

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In the past 6 weeks I have sailed from Ka&#351; to Ayvalik, an area that covers most of the Turkish Aegean and Aeolian coasts, with stays in marinas in many cities (Marmaris, Fethiye, Kas, Kusadasi, Cesme, Ayvalik) and in various anchorages popular with cruisers, and have not encountered anything that would give me the slightest concern.

Mark

S/V Sabbatical III, ASM #419
currently in Ayvalik, Turkey