[Amel Yacht Owners] Spreader cracks


Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Do you have photos? Have you contacted Amel?

If you have photos, contact Amel with the photos and ask for guidance. SAV"at"amel.fr

Bill
BeBe 387

On Tue, Oct 13, 2015 at 8:04 AM, jamiectelfer@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

We have discovered that we have some small cracks starting to form on the front edge of the main mast lower spreaders. They do not seem to be in the weld but are just at the point where the weld joins the alloy spreader extrusion.  I will try to post a couple of pictures in the photos section. The upper spreaders look fine.


Has anyone else had this problem?  Is there a recognised or suggested fix?  I have talked to two different riggers who have both suggested some form of strengthening plate in addition to some sort of weld repair. Both have worked on Amels before but have not come across this problem on other Amels and I can’t find any other posts on the subject since the Crusader issue over a decade ago.

I am also of course keen to identify what is causing the problem as we have not encountered any particularly rough seas this year or spent any extended period of time pounding upwind in ocean conditions (and I still wouldn’t expect this issue even if we had!)

Any input or suggestions would be most welcome.  Interestingly both the riggers we well aware of this forum and both independently suggested it should be my first source of knowledge and information.

Jamie Telfer
Bamboozle SM 388
Manly 
Brisbane 




bamboozle388
 

Hi Bill,

Thanks for your rapid reply and I have posted a couple of pictures in the photos section. The cracking is still quite small but they are probably not something I want to leave and watch grow!

I have contacted Amel but have not heard back from them yet.  I am hoping this is not unique to Bamboozle and that maybe Joel or Olivier may have some thoughts on the subject given their range of experience across the whole fleet.

I enjoy your posts about Bebe, particularly as Bamboozle was the next hull out of the factory so anything you encounter I am always on the look out for!

regards

Jamie
Bamboozle 388
Manly
Brisbane


Beaute Olivier
 

Good morning Jamie,

these cracks should be investigated and treated. This means that you should first strip the paint off and watch the extent of the crack. If the crack is really affecting the metal (and not only the paint), you should take the spreader down and bring it to a good aluminum workshop for re-doing the welding. For that, they may need to put an additionnal piece of aluminum.
Is the crack the same on the portside spreader?

Now about the cause:
How many nautical miles on the log? Cracks can come from fatigue stress, after hundred thousands hits in choppy waves. This is why it is important to have the masts and rigging inspected every year (at least) or after any rough sailing.

If only one spreader shows a crack, this may come from the spreader hitting something (a wall, a neighbor's spreaders in the harbor, another vessel while sailing...) but then you should see some marks at the spreader's end.

This may also be a rather bad weld, with a too big gap between both pieces of aluminum.

Have a good day.

Olivier





On Tuesday, October 13, 2015 10:52 PM, "jamiectelfer@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Hi Bill,

Thanks for your rapid reply and I have posted a couple of pictures in the photos section. The cracking is still quite small but they are probably not something I want to leave and watch grow!

I have contacted Amel but have not heard back from them yet.  I am hoping this is not unique to Bamboozle and that maybe Joel or Olivier may have some thoughts on the subject given their range of experience across the whole fleet.

I enjoy your posts about Bebe, particularly as Bamboozle was the next hull out of the factory so anything you encounter I am always on the look out for!

regards

Jamie
Bamboozle 388
Manly
Brisbane



Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Jamie,

I do not think that you have to wait for Amel. You just received the best advice and analysis from Olivier who worked for Amel for many years.

He asked the question that I was thinking about and that is "is it just the paint." I did not ask the question because after looking at your photographs I came to the conclusion that it was not just the paint because there is no evidence of bubbling which is normal once the paint is cracked. 

My guess (and it is a guess) is that the crack is fairly new because of the lack of bubbling. Bubbling happens when moisture gets between the paint and the aluminum and will be evident where the paint was not applied properly and at stress points on the masts, booms and spreaders...you probably have some bubbling on the booms at the junction to the masts and at the bottom of the masts.

So, your situation is clear, remove the spreaders and take them to a trusted aluminum welder. Have them repainted by someone with experience in painting aluminum.

Good luck.

Bill
BeBe 387

On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 7:35 AM, Beaute Olivier atlanticyachtsurvey@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Good morning Jamie,

these cracks should be investigated and treated. This means that you should first strip the paint off and watch the extent of the crack. If the crack is really affecting the metal (and not only the paint), you should take the spreader down and bring it to a good aluminum workshop for re-doing the welding. For that, they may need to put an additionnal piece of aluminum.
Is the crack the same on the portside spreader?

Now about the cause:
How many nautical miles on the log? Cracks can come from fatigue stress, after hundred thousands hits in choppy waves. This is why it is important to have the masts and rigging inspected every year (at least) or after any rough sailing.

If only one spreader shows a crack, this may come from the spreader hitting something (a wall, a neighbor's spreaders in the harbor, another vessel while sailing...) but then you should see some marks at the spreader's end.

This may also be a rather bad weld, with a too big gap between both pieces of aluminum.

Have a good day.

Olivier





On Tuesday, October 13, 2015 10:52 PM, "jamiect elfer@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


 
Hi Bill,

Thanks for your rapid reply and I have posted a couple of pictures in the photos section. The cracking is still quite small but they are probably not something I want to leave and watch grow!

I have contacted Amel but have not heard back from them yet.  I am hoping this is not unique to Bamboozle and that maybe Joel or Olivier may have some thoughts on the subject given their range of experience across the whole fleet.

I enjoy your posts about Bebe, particularly as Bamboozle was the next hull out of the factory so anything you encounter I am always on the look out for!

regards

Jamie
Bamboozle 388
Manly
Brisbane




alainfeuillet@...
 

Dear all, when I look at Jamie's photos I remember that I have been an aeronautical engineer wit some knowledge of welding cracks... My first guess is that there is an abnormal rearward bending moment on the spreader. The welding looks pretty good and I would more look for an incorrect rigging of the standing rig that on an Amel production failure
So Jamie first question you should look into: when and how did your last standing rigging occure? who re-rigged yourboat?
Have a look in particular to your capshrouds position = are they making a plan with the mast and the spreader or do you have a tilt at the spreaders level? the more tilt, the more rearward bending moment. It this so your mast is two much forward on the boat.
Hope it can help.
Alain
(Pilgrim SM#26)


jjjk12s@...
 

 

Just a suggestion of a possible alternative cause.....Maybe in the past a sun awning tied too tight in strong wind between the main and mizzen shroulds could do this by putting rear-ward pressure on the spreader? I sometimes use an awning but wouldn't attach it to the shroud.

John Maramu #91


Duane Siegfri
 

Maybe I'm the only one who doesn't understand where this crack is.  The spreader is attached to the mast via a hinge bolt (if I recall correctly).  The photo appears to have the spreader welded to the mast...is that correct?

Duane
Wanderer SM477


Bob Grey
 

Dear all, I own a 55 and the rig is similar and I have two running back stays for when the staysail only is being used to stop the mast flexing/shuddering bending forward at this spreader point. I'm not sure if earlier boats have this. I have noticed through this blog on older boats that  54, M and SM issues seem to have been addressed incrementally in my boat. We all agree an abnormal rear pressure or vibration will cause such cracking so my question is do earlier Amels have a running back stay from this spreader point. Mine is a quite thick black rope normally tied to the spreader deck stays.  I run this through the rear deck pulley and onto the Genoa track winch so when tacking into sharp seas with a bit of pounding on staysai. It really does reduce the main mast flex and vibration.

I have pics of this setup if anyone is interested.


Robert Grey
Renaissance 3 A55 #25


Warren Traill
 

Thanks Robert. I have a 1980 Sharki that has a running backstay to a winch at the mizzen mast. I have wondered why and what it was there for. You have suggested a very valid reason. I would love to see the pics.

Warren Traill
Manon2 #15

Sent from Windows Mail

From: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]
Sent: ‎Thursday‎, ‎15‎ ‎October‎ ‎2015 ‎9‎:‎15‎ ‎a.m.
To: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]

 

Dear all, I own a 55 and the rig is similar and I have two running back stays for when the staysail only is being used to stop the mast flexing/shuddering bending forward at this spreader point. I'm not sure if earlier boats have this. I have noticed through this blog on older boats that  54, M and SM issues seem to have been addressed incrementally in my boat. We all agree an abnormal rear pressure or vibration will cause such cracking so my question is do earlier Amels have a running back stay from this spreader point. Mine is a quite thick black rope normally tied to the spreader deck stays.  I run this through the rear deck pulley and onto the Genoa track winch so when tacking into sharp seas with a bit of pounding on staysai. It really does reduce the main mast flex and vibration.


I have pics of this setup if anyone is interested.


Robert Grey
Renaissance 3 A55 #25



amel46met
 













From Thomas Deasy S/Y Aphrodite Maramu 1983.
When I bought my boat,15 years ago, the starboard main mast spreader had a crack on the front edge one foot long close to the mast. The boat had a reel wire main halyard it seemed the wire had chafed for some time . I had it welded and the fix seems to have worked.
I am under way from Vanuatu to Bundaberg, Australia. Thanks group for all the help over the years.












To: amelyachtowners@...
From: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2015 01:51:36 +0000
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Spreader cracks

 

Thanks Robert. I have a 1980 Sharki that has a running backstay to a winch at the mizzen mast. I have wondered why and what it was there for. You have suggested a very valid reason. I would love to see the pics.

Warren Traill
Manon2 #15

Sent from Windows Mail

From: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]
Sent: ‎Thursday‎, ‎15‎ ‎October‎ ‎2015 ‎9‎:‎15‎ ‎a.m.
To: divanz620@... [amelyachtowners]

 
Dear all, I own a 55 and the rig is similar and I have two running back stays for when the staysail only is being used to stop the mast flexing/shuddering bending forward at this spreader point. I'm not sure if earlier boats have this. I have noticed through this blog on older boats that  54, M and SM issues seem to have been addressed incrementally in my boat. We all agree an abnormal rear pressure or vibration will cause such cracking so my question is do earlier Amels have a running back stay from this spreader point. Mine is a quite thick black rope normally tied to the spreader deck stays.  I run this through the rear deck pulley and onto the Genoa track winch so when tacking into sharp seas with a bit of pounding on staysai. It really does reduce the main mast flex and vibration.

I have pics of this setup if anyone is interested.


Robert Grey
Renaissance 3 A55 #25




Alan Leslie
 

Most Maramus and Super Maramus do not have inner forestays and hence no running backstays.
Any yacht with an inner forestay that has, or can have, a sail on it, should have running backstays to prevent mast pumping in strong winds, otherwise they are not necessary.
Cheers
Alan
Elyse SM437


bamboozle388
 

Thank you Olivier and indeed everyone else who has provided such helpful input.

I have just been up the mast and stripped the paint off the area on both spreaders. Having done this it would seem that the cracking may only be superficial and in the paint. There does not appear to be evidence of any underlying cracking in the aluminium or the weld.  I am going to get a professional rigger to have a look at it again tomorrow and see what he thinks and see if he agrees with me.  I suppose the question is now (assuming it is just the surface paint cracking) whether it still requires removal and strengthening and it is still going to be important to identify what is causing it.

In response to some of the questions asked about the history of the boat and rig we have sailed about 27,000 nm (mainly ocean) on Bamboozle since we bought her in 2008.  We don't know exactly how much she had done before then but I think she had pretty much only been transatlantic when new and then a couple of times up and down the length of the east coast of the States.

I am (almost) absolutely certain the spreaders have not come in to contact with anything or another rig and it is present on both lower spreaders although it is VERY minor on the port spreader. 

The spreader is attached to a hinge bolt.....the issue is at the point where the aluminium extrusion is welded to the base which then bolts to the mast.

We replaced all the standing rigging about 15 months ago so I am wondering if we have not quite got the tuning right again after that leading to the kind of pressures Alain wrote about.  We will have a very good look at the position of the capshrouds and indeed the set up of the whole rig.

We do get the rigging professional inspected about once a year and I always go up the mast and check it over myself after each ocean trip (about twice a year) so hopefully we have caught this very early.  I didn't see any evidence of it when I was up there in June.        

So......I will see if the rigger here (Scott Keogh, SK Yacht Rigging) agrees with my assessment and if necessary get another expert opinion.  

If it is just the paint maybe I should just check the set up of the rig and then watch the area very closely for a while?  I am not sure a welder would have anything to fix at present!  Should I be examining ways of strengthening it or do you think the key thing is to make sure it is not subject to any unusual pressures?

Again thanks for all the helpful contributions and I will report back tomorrow on what a more experienced pair of eyes can see in the aluminium and weld.

As an aside, we have had a great visit this morning from Colin Streeter (Island Pearl II) who dropped by to welcome us to Brisbane. Hopefully we may get to cruise in company with him a bit next year.

Cheers

Jamie
Bamboozle SM388



Beaute Olivier
 

Hello Jamie,

when you replaced the rigging, I hope the rigger installed it the same way as previously: at first spreaders external end, the top shroud is installed aft of the intermediate shroud (the intermediate in front of the top one).
The second typical specification on AMEL vessels is that the standing rigging should be very tight (compared to some other sailing vessels). A loose setting may involve more vibrations under load.
Very tight means that when close hauling in 20 knots winds, the leeward shrouds should not be loose at all.

Is the portside spreader affected with the same type of crack?

Olivier.



On Thursday, October 15, 2015 7:16 AM, "jamiectelfer@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Thank you Olivier and indeed everyone else who has provided such helpful input.

I have just been up the mast and stripped the paint off the area on both spreaders. Having done this it would seem that the cracking may only be superficial and in the paint. There does not appear to be evidence of any underlying cracking in the aluminium or the weld.  I am going to get a professional rigger to have a look at it again tomorrow and see what he thinks and see if he agrees with me.  I suppose the question is now (assuming it is just the surface paint cracking) whether it still requires removal and strengthening and it is still going to be important to identify what is causing it.

In response to some of the questions asked about the history of the boat and rig we have sailed about 27,000 nm (mainly ocean) on Bamboozle since we bought her in 2008.  We don't know exactly how much she had done before then but I think she had pretty much only been transatlantic when new and then a couple of times up and down the length of the east coast of the States.

I am (almost) absolutely certain the spreaders have not come in to contact with anything or another rig and it is present on both lower spreaders although it is VERY minor on the port spreader. 

The spreader is attached to a hinge bolt.....the issue is at the point where the aluminium extrusion is welded to the base which then bolts to the mast.

We replaced all the standing rigging about 15 months ago so I am wondering if we have not quite got the tuning right again after that leading to the kind of pressures Alain wrote about.  We will have a very good look at the position of the capshrouds and indeed the set up of the whole rig.

We do get the rigging professional inspected about once a year and I always go up the mast and check it over myself after each ocean trip (about twice a year) so hopefully we have caught this very early.  I didn't see any evidence of it when I was up there in June.        

So......I will see if the rigger here (Scott Keogh, SK Yacht Rigging) agrees with my assessment and if necessary get another expert opinion.  

If it is just the paint maybe I should just check the set up of the rig and then watch the area very closely for a while?  I am not sure a welder would have anything to fix at present!  Should I be examining ways of strengthening it or do you think the key thing is to make sure it is not subject to any unusual pressures?

Again thanks for all the helpful contributions and I will report back tomorrow on what a more experienced pair of eyes can see in the aluminium and weld.

As an aside, we have had a great visit this morning from Colin Streeter (Island Pearl II) who dropped by to welcome us to Brisbane. Hopefully we may get to cruise in company with him a bit next year.

Cheers

Jamie
Bamboozle SM388





Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Jamie,

First of all I have no direct experience with your situation and whatever I add/suggest should be taken with that in mind.

It makes sense to me that the crack in the paint is recent, probably less than one year. The reason I think it is recent is if the paint had been cracked longer, there would be bubbling around the crack caused by moisture intrusion between the paint and the aluminum.

Therefore, I believe that the evidence points toward something recently happened that caused this. I think that if I were you, I would want to determine the cause of the stress that caused the cracking as well as the true condition of the weld.

I am assuming from the photos that the crack is on the top of the "U" shaped aluminium piece that is welded to the spreader arm...and the "U" shaped piece attaches via a bolt to the mast. And that "U" shaped piece allows for some forward/backward movement/flex of the spreader arm. If I am correct, some downward force/flex would be the cause of the cracking. I am correct on these things?

If I am correct in all of the above, I would ask myself what force causing downward force/flex has happened. I do not know the answer, but if I were guessing, I would ask:
  1. Supported weight: Has any person been on and/or stood on this spreader? This could have happened for several reasons, maybe including re-rigging, installation of spreader lights, etc.. 
  2. Lifting point: Has the spreader been used to lift anything?
  3. Is it possible that when a pole was set that the boat rolled and the pole tip went in the water?
  4. Is it possible that when a pole was rigged too much force was put on the up or down lines? (I have often wondered about this and what is too much...I have never heard this answered).
  5. Is it possible that a pole was used with a "flopper stopper" to reduce roll while at anchor?
  6. Has the pole been used to lift anything out of the water?
  7. Is it possible that a pole was used by some kids to dive off of?
  8. Is it possible if the rigging was over-tightened?
I am sure that none of the above has happened in your presence, but it is worth thinking about. The primary reason I listed all of these is for some newcomers who might think that that spreader can take tremendous amounts of downward force, and have not thought about the consequences.

Like I said, I do not know, but like you said, you and I are very interested in each other's SMs since our boats were made at exactly the same time with one number difference in the hull numbers.

I hope that I have added something to the resolution, however, remember that I said that I have no direct knowledge. My direct email is svbebe"at"gmail.com

Bill
Bebe 387
Rabat, Morocco

On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 5:16 AM, jamiectelfer@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Thank you Olivier and indeed everyone else who has provided such helpful input.


I have just been up the mast and stripped the paint off the area on both spreaders. Having done this it would seem that the cracking may only be superficial and in the paint. There does not appear to be evidence of any underlying cracking in the aluminium or the weld.  I am going to get a professional rigger to have a look at it again tomorrow and see what he thinks and see if he agrees with me.  I suppose the question is now (assuming it is just the surface paint cracking) whether it still requires removal and strengthening and it is still going to be important to identify what is causing it.

In response to some of the questions asked about the history of the boat and rig we have sailed about 27,000 nm (mainly ocean) on Bamboozle since we bought her in 2008.  We don't know exactly how mu ch she had done before then but I think she had pretty much only been transatlantic when new and then a couple of times up and down the length of the east coast of the States.

I am (almost) absolutely certain the spreaders have not come in to contact with anything or another rig and it is present on both lower spreaders although it is VERY minor on the port spreader. 

The spreader is attached to a hinge bolt.....the issue is at the point where the aluminium extrusion is welded to the base which then bolts to the mast.

We replaced all the standing rigging about 15 months ago so I am wondering if we have not quite got the tuning right again after that leading to the kind of pressures Alain wrote about.  We will have a very good look at the position of the capshrouds and indeed the set up of the whole rig.

We do get the rigging professional inspected about once a year and I alw ays go up the mast and check it over myself after each ocean trip (about twice a year) so hopefully we have caught this very early.  I didn't see any evidence of it when I was up there in June.        

So......I will see if the rigger here (Scott Keogh, SK Yacht Rigging) agrees with my assessment and if necessary get another expert opinion.  

If it is just the paint maybe I should just check the set up of the rig and then watch the area very closely for a while?  I am not sure a welder would have anything to fix at present!  Should I be examining ways of strengthening it or do you think the key thing is to make sure it is not subject to any unusual pressures?

Again thanks for all the helpful contributions and I will report back tomorrow on what a more experienced pair of eyes can see in the aluminium and weld.

As an aside, we have had a grea t visit this morning from Colin Streeter (Island Pearl II) who dropped by to welcome us to Brisbane. Hopefully we may get to cruise in company with him a bit next year.

Cheers

Jamie
Bamboozle SM388




bamboozle388
 

Hello Olivier,

The port-side is much less visible and to my amateur eye really does seem only to be in the surface paint. 

Yes, the shrouds are the right way round (I have to confess I did just go up on deck to check!). The rigger who did it has worked with Amels before and we tried to replicate the same tight set up with me checking that there is no looseness in the leeward shrouds when on the wind.....HOWEVER during this season I had noticed a very slight new vibration in the upper section of the mast with certain wind angles over the rig when we are tied up to the dock (but not when sailing or at anchor).  When we replaced the rigging we set the mast up to be pretty straight with no bend aft-wards but I think I can now detect a very slight inversion (forward bend) at the top of the mast. The reason I had a rigger on the boat when we arrived in Brisbane was not only to check the whole rig but also to consult him about adjusting this, albeit only marginally. We certainly didn't seem to have any extra movement or pumping when sailing but I am now wondering if this may be part of the issue or at least an indication of it.

If the cracking does turn out to only be superficial (in the paint) do you think we should still take further action on the spreaders or just make sure the set up is absolutely correct and keep a close eye on it?

Bien cordialement

Jamie
Bamboozle SM #388


bamboozle388
 

Bill,

You make some very good points and raise some interesting questions.

For clarity the paint cracking is on the leading (fwd) edge of the spreaders.  On the Stb spreader it is on the lower front side implying rearwards (and/or slight upwards) pressure. 

On the port spreader it is on the upper front implying rearwards and slight downward pressure.    On this port spreader the cracking is VERY minor and I have now posted 2 pictures (in the the same album) to show this.

Your eight questions are certainly pertinent (and probably to all SM owners) but it has not been stood on, used for lifting or for a flopper stopper, dived off and we haven’t ever dipped the pole.

In terms of the pressure from the pole rigging lines I have wondered about this in the past myself but we haven’t used the pole in anything other than reasonably gentle conditions in the last year or two.

I keep coming back to the set up of the rigging not being quite right!?! Too tight, too loose or the u bolts that fix the ends of the spreaders not quite in the right place. As mentioned in my last post to Olivier we have had an odd vibration in the rigging in recent months when in dock with stronger wind from certain directions flowing over the rig.

The rigger is die any minute so we’ll see what he says now the paint is off.

Jamie 


alainfeuillet@...
 

Dear jamie,
the place of the crack that you are indicating was clearly my assumption when I looked at your photos. This is why I recommended you to check if your spreader is in the plan formed by the mast and the bottom of the cap shroud. You can see it if you look your capshroud in the direction of the masthead, from the quay if the boat is alongside, or from your tender in the water. You can try to compare your situation the photo number 2 of this link http://www.yachttech.com/images/gallery/mast-construction-2.jpg which shows a very good plan including mast, spreaders and shroud. No forward/rearward tilt in the shroud.

 

I apologise if I am a bit boring but if your spreader is not in this plan, the more angle on the sroud at the level of the spreader you have the more forward or rearward bending moment on the foot of the spreader which induces tis typical kind of crack.
The articulation of the spreader, by design, can accomodate any vertical misriggng of the spreader tip but none in the X axis of the boat.
The looseness of the rigging can not cause this kind of damage. It can only introduce shocks in the compression on the spreader which would induce another type of damage.

The only certain and quite simple method to check whether your spreader has been damaged is crack detection with Liquid Penetrant Testing. It consists in removing paint very locally, spraying a coloured penetrant, removing it from the surface and spraying a white powder . If there is a crack, the penetrant will reappear on the white powder. Your issue will be to find a specialist to make this because precautions have to be taken during the process and it requires some experience to be valid. It is used in aluminium boat building or repair.
 Hope it helps
Alain


bamboozle388
 

Alain,

We might have a slight angle on the shroud at the spreader as you suggest although it is quite hard to see. With the rigger we are going to loosen everything off and "start again" on the whole rig making sure everything is in the right plane, angle and tautness.  He also does not think the mast shape is not quite right so we will address all of this to make sure we have everything as it should be. Having inspected the area very closely he thinks we caught this very early and the cracking really was just in the paint. With the paint removed from the area there is absolutely no evidence of cracking in the spreader or damage to the weld and he thinks it isn't necessary to penetration dye test the area. There was obviously some movement to crack the paint (very very minor on the port side) but I (and he!) think we caught it early enough to avoid any real issues.
I am going to completely retune the rig, re-paint the area and watch it VERY closely. 

Thank you Alain for your extremely helpful information and input and indeed everyone who contributed on the subject.  Finding it was so unexpected I hope I may have got a bit over excited when I put "Spreader Cracks" as the subject at the start of the thread!

Cheers

Jamie
Bamboozle 388


Beaute Olivier
 

Good morning Jamie,

talking about mast setting and rigging tuning, once tuned, the mast should be straight sideways, and from front to aft, but showing a permanent (while not sailing) slight bend with the masthead a little aft of the mast foot, and the mid mast a little bit in front.
Then, checking at sea, the mast head should not bend forward of the second spreaders.

While tuning the rigging, the intermediate shroud U-bolts (at first spreaders) should be loosened. The boomerangs should not be installed before final tuning.

Have a good day.

Olivier.



On Monday, October 19, 2015 11:56 PM, "jamiectelfer@... [amelyachtowners]" wrote:


 
Alain,

We might have a slight angle on the shroud at the spreader as you suggest although it is quite hard to see. With the rigger we are going to loosen everything off and "start again" on the whole rig making sure everything is in the right plane, angle and tautness.  He also does not think the mast shape is not quite right so we will address all of this to make sure we have everything as it should be. Having inspected the area very closely he thinks we caught this very early and the cracking really was just in the paint. With the paint removed from the area there is absolutely no evidence of cracking in the spreader or damage to the weld and he thinks it isn't necessary to penetration dye test the area. There was obviously some movement to crack the paint (very very minor on the port side) but I (and he!) think we caught it early enough to avoid any real issues.
I am going to completely retune the rig, re-paint the area and watch it VERY closely. 

Thank you Alain for your extremely helpful information and input and indeed everyone who contributed on the subject.  Finding it was so unexpected I hope I may have got a bit over excited when I put "Spreader Cracks" as the subject at the start of the thread!

Cheers

Jamie
Bamboozle 388



Peter Killen
 

Hi Olivier,
What is your business email address?  I hope to have "Pure Magic" based in La Rochelle next winter and would like to contact you.

Kind regards,

Peter

SM 433 

On 20 Oct 2015, at 08:28, Beaute Olivier atlanticyachtsurvey@... [amelyachtowners] wrote:

 

Good morning Jamie,

talking about mast setting and rigging tuning, once tuned, the mast should be straight sideways, and from front to aft, but showing a permanent (while not sailing) slight bend with the masthead a little aft of the mast foot, and the mid mast a little bit in front.
Then, checking at sea, the mast head should not bend forward of the second spreaders.

While tuning the rigging, the intermediate shroud U-bolts (at first spreaders) should be loosened. The boomerangs should not be installed before final tuning.

Have a good day.

Olivier.



On Monday, October 19, 2015 11:56 PM, "jamiectelfer@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:


 
Alain,

We might have a slight angle on the shroud at the spreader as you suggest although it is quite hard to see. With the rigger we are going to loosen everything off and "start again" on the whole rig making sure everything is in the right plane, angle and tautness.  He also does not think the mast shape is not quite right so we will address all of this to make sure we have everything as it should be. Having inspected the area very closely he thinks we caught this very early and the cracking really was just in the paint. With the paint removed from the area there is absolutely no evidence of cracking in the spreader or damage to the weld and he thinks it isn't necessary to penetration dye test the area. There was obviously some movement to crack the paint (very very minor on the port side) but I (and he!) think we caught it early enough to avoid any real issues.
I am going to completely retune the rig, re-paint the area and watch it VERY closely. 

Thank you Alain for your extremely helpful information and input and indeed everyone who contributed on the subject.  Finding it was so unexpected I hope I may have got a bit over excited when I put "Spreader Cracks" as the subject at the start of the thread!

Cheers

Jamie
Bamboozle 388