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[Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Copper coat

James Alton
 

Ian,

   What is your opinion of the effectiveness of Copper Coat in Tropical waters?  

    My understanding is that the epoxy used in the Copper Coat system is water based (cleanup of tools etc, is simply done with plain water) and designed to slowly dissolve to expose more copper over time. So while the epoxy coating has some barrier coating qualities it is not really a barrier coat per se in case your boat needs this,  hence my reference to the possible need of an epoxy coating for a barrier coat rather than it being needed as a primer.  I agree with the need for the alcohol thinner,  especially with warm temperatures which make the pot life pretty short.

James Alton
SV, Sueno, Maramu #220

On May 13, 2017, at 3:17 AM, parkianj@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Paul
Our boat had coppercoat of an unknown age, with some patches.
We had the the hull stripped back in Trinidad and reapplied Coppercoat ourselves. The yard tried to persuade us to apply two coats of epoxy to the hull first. Coppercoat told us to apply straight on to the clean hull since it is an epoxy coating in itself . We did this. 
If you do it yourself a team of 4-6 people could do the job in a day with one person continually supplying the mixed epoxy. Linda and I on our own took 3 days - but that was in the heat in Trinidad!
You do need to thin the Coppercoat with rubbing alcohol to roller it on. The total cost was around£1300.00, but we had imported the Coppercoat from UK and avoided VAT. Of course the smaller hull needed less. 
Did you have a breakdown of the costs?

Ian

Ocean Hobo SN96
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

You might want to look at this photo. 

The answer about coppercoat effectiveness depends on many factors. One factor is the location and environment. Another is the required maintenance of coppercoat. I know many people who would judge coppercoat as a failure because it requires cleaning and scraping. If you want antifouling to do its job without your help and your location is prone to fouling, you probably don't​ want coppercoat. 

The owner of the cat in the above comparison photo did not like his new coppercoat bottom. That is BeBe, SM387 in the photo comparison. Both boats had antifouling applied in about the same place and the same time and both had about the same sea miles. 

The people I know that like coppercoat would be satisfied with the performance in the photo and would have already scraped the hull once or twice. 

I believe the biggest variables in whether Coppercoat will perform well is you and your expectations. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970




   

On May 13, 2017 07:55, "James Alton lokiyawl2@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Ian,


   What is your opinion of the effectiveness of Copper Coat in Tropical waters?  

    My understanding is that the epoxy used in the Copper Coat system is water based (cleanup of tools etc, is simply done with plain water) and designed to slowly dissolve to expose more copper over time. So while the epoxy coating has some barrier coating qualities it is not really a barrier coat per se in case your boat needs this,  hence my reference to the possible need of an epoxy coating for a barrier coat rather than it being needed as a primer.  I agree with the need for the alcohol thinner,  especially with warm temperatures which make the pot life pretty short.

James Alton
SV, Sueno, Maramu #220

On May 13, 2017, at 3:17 AM, parkianj@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Paul
Our boat had coppercoat of an unknown age, with some patches.
We had the the hull stripped back in Trinidad and reapplied Coppercoat ourselves. The yard tried to persuade us to apply two coats of epoxy to the hull first. Coppercoat told us to apply straight on to the clean hull since it is an epoxy coating in itself . We did this. 
If you do it yourself a team of 4-6 people could do the job in a day with one person continually supplying the mixed epoxy. Linda and I on our own took 3 days - but that was in the heat in Trinidad!
You do need to thin the Coppercoat with rubbing alcohol to roller it on. The total cost was around£1300.00, but we had imported the Coppercoat from UK and avoided VAT. Of course the smaller hull needed less. 
Did you have a breakdown of the costs?

Ian

Ocean Hobo SN96
Ian Park
 

James
Yes it is water based and rollers are easily cleaned on water. On the third day of applying in Trinidad a big black cloud appeared and unloaded on us. It washed the two coats we were applying to the final third of the boat. The other two thirds applied on the previous two days was untouched. We had enough to complete the job in the end!
I wasn't aware that Coppercoat eroded at all. To bring fresh copper to the surface you have to lightly sand the hull with an 800 grit paper. Check the barrier and eroding facts with Coppercoat - I'd be interested to know.
In the tropics we have a light coat of slime build up on the hull over a couple of months. I use a stainless wire wool to scrub it or a large scraper. I can do most of the hull with just a mask and snorkel. In home waters -Wales and Scotland - the build up was less (this with the old Coppercoat), but it hosed off quite easily with the boat dried out against a harbour wall.
It works for me, and the main thing I like is a very smooth hull, none of the peeled onion skin effect after a few years build up of eroding anti fouling. Oh, and I don't have the messy annual job of reapplying anti fouling.

Good luck

Ian
Ocean Hobo SN96
James Alton
 

Ian,

   Thanks for your input.  Perhaps erosion is not the correct term.  I was just reading that the Copper Coat becomes thinner over time and will require touch up and an eventual recoat so at some level material is being lost with time.  I guess that this could be due to  the mechanical abrasion from cleaning and sanding to expose new Copper, or perhaps the water based Epoxy softens some with immersion,  I am not sure.  The 4 coats that we applied seem to be fairly thin once sanded flat but incredibly hard when compared to any antifouling that I have ever used.  i don’t expect to see any Coppercoat smeared up on the bootop as the straps stretch like with some softer antifouling.

   I like what you said about the hull being very smooth and agree about the paint buildup problem.  One of the first things that struck me about my Amel Maramu was how fair and smooth the bottom is.  No bulkheads showing through, just a very fair 29 year old hull with nary a blister.   

  I hope that we cross paths someday, I would like to see “Ocean Hobo".

Best,

James

On May 13, 2017, at 10:20 AM, Ian Park parkianj@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

James
Yes it is water based and rollers are easily cleaned on water. On the third day of applying in Trinidad a big black cloud appeared and unloaded on us. It washed the two coats we were applying to the final third of the boat. The other two thirds applied on the previous two days was untouched. We had enough to complete the job in the end!
I wasn't aware that Coppercoat eroded at all. To bring fresh copper to the surface you have to lightly sand the hull with an 800 grit paper. Check the barrier and eroding facts with Coppercoat - I'd be interested to know.
In the tropics we have a light coat of slime build up on the hull over a couple of months. I use a stainless wire wool to scrub it or a large scraper. I can do most of the hull with just a mask and snorkel. In home waters -Wales and Scotland - the build up was less (this with the old Coppercoat), but it hosed off quite easily with the boat dried out against a harbour wall.
It works for me, and the main thing I like is a very smooth hull, none of the peeled onion skin effect after a few years build up of eroding anti fouling. Oh, and I don't have the messy annual job of reapplying anti fouling. 

Good luck

Ian 
Ocean Hobo SN96
Ian Park
 

James
Agree, the final dry application seems pretty thin, but it is very hard and very durable. I can't think of anything else you can vigorously attack with a stainless steel pan scrubber!
We missed a season in the Caribbean this year due to ailing parents. Next year we'll cruise the Windward area, then head back to UK via the OCC Azores rally. The Baltic and Scandinavia beckon next where the sun is more considerate to a fair skin!

Hope our passage plans cross somewhere.

Good luck with the hull.

Ian

Ocean Hobo SN96
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