Topics

[Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

eric freedman
 

Hi Tom,

I don’t notice any major list to port with the 70 gallons in the liferaft locker, possibly a degree or two.

Additionally the fuel in the tanks is not a permanent condition as is the batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2017 10:31 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

 

Hey Eric- I've been toying around with the idea of repurposing the life-raft locker in this way. One non-scientific data point that has given me pause is that when I last changed batteries, I had all 13 DT-31 batteries on the port side of my boat outside the cockpit waiting to be taken off. I noticed (or at least I perceived) a slight list of my boat to port. I wondered if 300 liters of fuel in the locker would create a similar issue. Have you noticed this ? Confession- I've done no calculations relating to the relative weights, the position of those weights, etc............one of those possible boat projects that sits idling in front of the first speed bump it encounters.

 

Tom Kleman

SV L'ORIENT

SM2K #422

Currently in Antigua 

greatketch@...
 


Tom,

300 liters of diesel would weigh about 640 lbs, Thirteen G31 batteries at about 75 lbs per would weigh between 900 and 1000 lbs.

Just another data point for you as you decide what to do...

I get the distinct impression I am a minority on this, but I personally would skip this project--unless you motor a lot. A Super Maramu has a range with the installed tanks of about 1000 miles.  Much more twice than my previous boat and I never felt the need for more fuel in that one.  I don't think I have ever motor-sailed our Amel, but others seem to do this quite a bit. We cruise full time, and buy fuel about four times a year.  For us, cutting out one fuel stop every 12 months just doesn't come close to justifying the project.

The liferaft locker does double duty on our boat, holding the raft and other things. I would need to make space in other places for them, and it's not worth it to me.  Also, we have the older boat with only 9 batteries, so we start out with a list to port from the weight of the generator on that side. I consider that list important, but maybe that's because I would rather sail in 4 or 5 knots of wind than listen to the motor...

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie



---In amelyachtowners@..., <kimberlite@...> wrote :

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2017 10:31 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

 

Hey Eric- I've been toying around with the idea of repurposing the life-raft locker in this way. One non-scientific data point that has given me pause is that when I last changed batteries, I had all 13 DT-31 batteries on the port side of my boat outside the cockpit waiting to be taken off. I noticed (or at least I perceived) a slight list of my boat to port. I wondered if 300 liters of fuel in the locker would create a similar issue. Have you noticed this ? Confession- I've done no calculations relating to the relative weights, the position of those weights, etc............one of those possible boat projects that sits idling in front of the first speed bump it encounters.

 

Tom Kleman

SV L'ORIENT

SM2K #422

Currently in Antigua 

James Cromie
 

Has anyone used the collapsible auxiliary fuel containers that are available?  They seem like a nice option for economizing in space when not needed. 

James
sm 347


On Dec 21, 2017, at 1:23 PM, 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Tom,

I don’t notice any major list to port with the 70 gallons in the liferaft locker, possibly a degree or two.

Additionally the fuel in the tanks is not a permanent condition as is the batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2017 10:31 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

 

Hey Eric- I've been toying around with the idea of repurposing the life-raft locker in this way. One non-scientific data point that has given me pause is that when I last changed batteries, I had all 13 DT-31 batteries on the port side of my boat outside the cockpit waiting to be taken off. I noticed (or at least I perceived) a slight list of my boat to port. I wondered if 300 liters of fuel in the locker would create a similar issue. Have you noticed this ? Confession- I've done no calculations relating to the relative weights, the position of those weights, etc............one of those possible boat projects that sits idling in front of the first speed bump it encounters.

 

Tom Kleman

SV L'ORIENT

SM2K #422

Currently in Antigua 

Patrick McAneny
 

Bill , I also have a list to port of maybe one or two degrees ,I can see ,feel it , I could never figure why. Amel would have certainly balanced things out in the design . While you have the generator to port , you have a fuel and batteries to starboard . I was concerned that some how my particular boat was mis formed , or my mast not centered , I took measurements . Do you think our boats came out of the factory with a list or is there another explanation.
Merry Christmas to all,
Pat SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]
To: amelyachtowners
Sent: Fri, Dec 22, 2017 12:29 am
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

Tom,

300 liters of diesel would weigh about 640 lbs, Thirteen G31 batteries at about 75 lbs per would weigh between 900 and 1000 lbs.

Just another data point for you as you decide what to do...

I get the distinct impression I am a minority on this, but I personally would skip this project--unless you motor a lot. A Super Maramu has a range with the installed tanks of about 1000 miles.  Much more twice than my previous boat and I never felt the need for more fuel in that one.  I don't think I have ever motor-sailed our Amel, but others seem to do this quite a bit. We c ruise full time, and buy fuel about four times a year.  For us, cutting out one fuel stop every 12 months just doesn't come close to justifying the project.

The liferaft locker does double duty on our boat, holding the raft and other things. I would need to make space in other places for them, and it's not worth it to me.  Also, we have the older boat with only 9 batteries, so we start out with a list to port from the weight of the generator on that side. I consider that list important, but maybe that's because I would rather sail in 4 or 5 knots of wind than listen to the motor...

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie



---In amelyachtowners@..., &l t;kimberlite@...> wrote :
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2017 10:31 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks
 
 
Hey Eric- I've been toying around with the idea of repurposing the life-raft locker in this way. One non-scientific data point that has given me pause is that when I last changed batteries, I had all 13 DT-31 batteries on the port side of my boat outside the cockpit waiting to be taken off. I noticed (or at least I perceived) a slight list of my boat to port. I wondered if 300 liters of fuel in the locker would create a similar issue. Have you noticed this ? Confession- I've done no calculations relating to the relative weights, the position of those weights, etc............one of those possible boat projects that sits idling in front of the first speed bump it encounters.
 
Tom Kleman
SV L'ORIENT
SM2K #422
Currently in Antigua 

Thomas Peacock
 

In the deeper, somewhat less reliable, parts of my memory, I recall having read on this forum several years ago that the SM was originally designed without a generator. However, as actual production neared, the decision was made to install a generator, which had to be placed on the port side of the boat, hence the roughly 1 degree list. Every SM I have been on has had that “feature”. 

Tom Peacock
SM #240 Aletes
Falmouth Harbour, Antigua


On Dec 22, 2017, at 8:29 AM, Patrick Mcaneny sailw32@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Bill , I also have a list to port of maybe one or two degrees ,I can see ,feel it , I could never figure why. Amel would have certainly balanced things out in the design . While you have the generator to port , you have a fuel and batteries to starboard . I was concerned that some how my particular boat was mis formed , or my mast not centered , I took measurements . Do you think our boats came out of the factory with a list or is there another explanation.

Merry Christmas to all,
Pat SM#123


-----Original Message-----
From: greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...>
To: amelyachtowners <amelyachtowners@...>
Sent: Fri, Dec 22, 2017 12:29 am
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

Tom,

300 liters of diesel would weigh about 640 lbs, Thirteen G31 batteries at about 75 lbs per would weigh between 900 and 1000 lbs.

Just another data point for you as you decide what to do...

I get the distinct impression I am a minority on this, but I personally would skip this project--unless you motor a lot. A Super Maramu has a range with the installed tanks of about 1000 miles.  Much more twice than my previous boat and I never felt the need for more fuel in that one.  I don't think I have ever motor-sailed our Amel, but others seem to do this quite a bit. We c ruise full time, and buy fuel about four times a year.  For us, cutting out one fuel stop every 12 months just doesn't come close to justifying the project.

The liferaft locker does double duty on our boat, holding the raft and other things. I would need to make space in other places for them, and it's not worth it to me.  Also, we have the older boat with only 9 batteries, so we start out with a list to port from the weight of the generator on that side. I consider that list important, but maybe that's because I would rather sail in 4 or 5 knots of wind than listen to the motor...

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie



---In amelyachtowners@..., &l t;kimberlite@...> wrote :
 
From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2017 10:31 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks
 
 
Hey Eric- I've been toying around with the idea of repurposing the life-raft locker in this way. One non-scientific data point that has given me pause is that when I last changed batteries, I had all 13 DT-31 batteries on the port side of my boat outside the cockpit waiting to be taken off. I noticed (or at least I perceived) a slight list of my boat to port. I wondered if 300 liters of fuel in the locker would create a similar issue. Have you noticed this ? Confession- I've done no calculations relating to the relative weights, the position of those weights, etc............one of those possible boat projects that sits idling in front of the first speed bump it encounters.
 
Tom Kleman
SV L'ORIENT
SM2K #422
Currently in Antigua 


eric freedman
 

James,

We also use nauta fuel tanks . they are 50 gallons each.

Fair Winds

 

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...]
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2017 7:01 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

 

Has anyone used the collapsible auxiliary fuel containers that are available?  They seem like a nice option for economizing in space when not needed. 

 

James

sm 347


On Dec 21, 2017, at 1:23 PM, 'sailormon' kimberlite@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Tom,

I don’t notice any major list to port with the 70 gallons in the liferaft locker, possibly a degree or two.

Additionally the fuel in the tanks is not a permanent condition as is the batteries.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2017 10:31 AM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

 

Hey Eric- I've been toying around with the idea of repurposing the life-raft locker in this way.. One non-scientific data point that has given me pause is that when I last changed batteries, I had all 13 DT-31 batteries on the port side of my boat outside the cockpit waiting to be taken off. I noticed (or at least I perceived) a slight list of my boat to port. I wondered if 300 liters of fuel in the locker would create a similar issue. Have you noticed this ? Confession- I've done no calculations relating to the relative weights, the position of those weights, etc............one of those possible boat projects that sits idling in front of the first speed bump it encounters.

 

Tom Kleman

SV L'ORIENT

SM2K #422

Currently in Antigua 

greatketch@...
 

James,

I used a Nauta flexible tank, not for fuel but as a holding tank on my old boat.  

Properly installed and protected from chafe they work great.  It can be tough securing them properly, and because they are flexible, it is impossible to stop the liquid contents from sloshing, so you need to be sure you don't make them so big, or put them in a such a place, that they can have an adverse effect on the stability of the boat.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Key West, Florida.


---In amelyachtowners@..., <jamescromie@...> wrote :

Has anyone used the collapsible auxiliary fuel containers that are available?  They seem like a nice option for economizing in space when not needed. 

James
sm 347


greatketch@...
 

Pat,

In my paperwork that has traveled with the boat since she was delivered, there is a drawing  labeled "Super Maramu, Hull #1" that shows the batteries installed across the front of the engine room.  If Hull #1 was actually initially assembled that way, the first time she hit the water I'll bet the batteries were relocated pretty quickly!

Ignoring interior cabinet work, the biggest permanent asymmetry in weight distribution is the generator and the batteries. Nine G31 batteries just don't add up to one Onan 6.5KW genset. Newer boats that have 13 batteries probably have less of an issue with this.

When we took delivery of our boat, she was essentially empty of all stores.  She had a list of about 1 degree to port, although she came very close to level when the fuel tank was topped off.. So my guess, is that's the way she came. 

With so much easily accessible storage on the port side (the liferaft locker, and the cockpit locker) it's really hard to keep from making that worse when the boat is your one and only home that has to hold everything.  But we try. 

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Key West, FL


---In amelyachtowners@..., <sailw32@...> wrote :

Bill , I also have a list to port of maybe one or two degrees ,I can see ,feel it , I could never figure why. Amel would have certainly balanced things out in the design . While you have the generator to port , you have a fuel and batteries to starboard . I was concerned that some how my particular boat was mis formed , or my mast not centered , I took measurements . Do you think our boats came out of the factory with a list or is there another explanation.
Merry Christmas to all,
Pat SM#123



thomas.kleman <no_reply@...>
 

Thanks Bill- We don't motor sail either, and try to sail from and to anchorable depths as a game (and for that time when our engine quits at an inopportune time). My interest in the fuel project is that we are planning on heading west from Bonaire after this next hurricane season and sailing to Columbia, Panama, and on to French Polynesia. I don't mind admitting that this will be a step up for us in terms of distance (it's just my wife and I).........I'm researching the fuel issue as I look at videos and read about the challenges of the routes I'm considering.

Depending on whether we stop in the Galapagos, the leg from Panama could be 28 days..........an extra 100-200 liters of fuel hopefully wouldn't be needed but might reduce my own stress in the first 10 days. We currently keep 5 Jerry cans in the life raft locker at the bottom and have the raft in the port cockpit lazarette. I'm not entirely happy with this arrangement and I've been researching alternatives for 3 years, off and on. 

Always good to get input from Amel owners who have more miles under their keels than we do.

eric freedman
 

Hi Thomas,

Did you read my posts about adding fuel bladders and auxiliary tanks to  Kimberlite Amel

Super Maramu #376?

 

The fuel in the Galapagos can be quite poor and I would not suggest taking on fuel there.

Fair Winds

Eric

 

 

From: amelyachtowners@... [mailto:amelyachtowners@...] On Behalf Of thomas.kleman
Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2017 3:31 PM
To: amelyachtowners@...
Subject: RE: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: Auxiliary fuel tanks

 

 

Thanks Bill- We don't motor sail either, and try to sail from and to anchorable depths as a game (and for that time when our engine quits at an inopportune time). My interest in the fuel project is that we are planning on heading west from Bonaire after this next hurricane season and sailing to Columbia, Panama, and on to French Polynesia. I don't mind admitting that this will be a step up for us in terms of distance (it's just my wife and I).........I'm researching the fuel issue as I look at videos and read about the challenges of the routes I'm considering.

 

Depending on whether we stop in the Galapagos, the leg from Panama could be 28 days..........an extra 100-200 liters of fuel hopefully wouldn't be needed but might reduce my own stress in the first 10 days. We currently keep 5 Jerry cans in the life raft locker at the bottom and have the raft in the port cockpit lazarette. I'm not entirely happy with this arrangement and I've been researching alternatives for 3 years, off and on. 

 

Always good to get input from Amel owners who have more miles under their keels than we do.

Mark Pitt
 

Hi Thomas,

   I burned quite a bit of fuel doing the Panama to Galapagos trip in 2004 in my SM.  I bought fuel in Academy Bay (Galapagos) and ran it though my fuel polisher on the way to my tank.  Other cruisers with me in the Galapago also bought fuel and used their Baja or other filters.  None of us had a problem.  Compared to Indonesia and some other places, the fuel seem quite good.  On the 19 day passage from the Galapagos to Fatu Hiva (Marquesas) we only used about 300 liters but at the time of departure I certainly felt better knowing that the boat was full up with fuel (including 8 jerry cans).  I even filled a couple of jerry cans on Islas Isabella just before departure. The Galapagos was great -- a real highlight, albeit a bit rolly.  Don't miss it over fuel concerns.

    Mark Pitt

  Sabbatical III, SM #419, currently in Spain


On 12/27/2017 3:31 PM, thomas.kleman wrote:
Thanks Bill- We don't motor sail either, and try to sail from and to anchorable depths as a game (and for that time when our engine quits at an inopportune time). My interest in the fuel project is that we are planning on heading west from Bonaire after this next hurricane season and sailing to Columbia, Panama, and on to French Polynesia. I don't mind admitting that this will be a step up for us in terms of distance (it's just my wife and I).........I'm researching the fuel issue as I look at videos and read about the challenges of the routes I'm considering.

Depending on whether we stop in the Galapagos, the leg from Panama could be 28 days..........an extra 100-200 liters of fuel hopefully wouldn't be needed but might reduce my own stress in the first 10 days. We currently keep 5 Jerry cans in the life raft locker at the bottom and have the raft in the port cockpit lazarette. I'm not entirely happy with this arrangement and I've been researching alternatives for 3 years, off and on. 

Always good to get input from Amel owners who have more miles under their keels than we do.