[Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck


Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Got confused with the vessel name! Thought Duane was selling his.

Alin, the best would be to take pictures showing the exact location.
Does this SM2K has (or had) a staysail?

Hope the final survey will be good

Sincerely, Alexandre (Formally #289)



--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 5/31/18, Alin Misescu alin1923@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck
To: "amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, May 31, 2018, 2:02 PM


 









Hi everyone.  This is my  very first post 
here.I
am buying (hopefully)  a SM hull 283, Wanderer in NZ.  The
surveyor found delamination in few spots on deck. 4 areas
ranging from 10 to 20 square CM.  2 of them have cracks in
the gelcoat and you can hear different noise when tapping. 
You can also feel a v slight bump when you run your hand
over it.  Any thoughts or ideas are much appreciated. 
Thank you. Alin
Misescu 
Sent
from Yahoo Mail on Android


Alin Misescu
 

Hi. No she does not have a staysail. I will come back with a picture.
Thank you.


johnericmorton@...
 

Hi Alin and Amel Owners

Just to clarify for other Amel Yacht Owners.  We are selling Wanderer after six great years of proud ownership in NZ.  When the sale goes through we plan to buy an Amel boat in the Mediterranean so we can spend six months each year in NZ then up to six months in the med live on board.  We don't have the appetite to face the challenge of sailing from NZ to Europe.

Alin's surveyor did the woodpecker thing with his light hammer on the deck and marked what he suspected could possibly be small localised areas of delamination requiring further investigation.   The underwater hull all "tapped out" OK.  :)-  and Wanderer otherwise has a clean bill of health.

The Surveyor lost a bit of credibility with me when he commented on "water ingress in the rudder"  (it's hollow by design) and his verbal recommendation to "drop off" the keel so he could check the mild steel attachment bolts.  (They are stainless steel and its not recommended to drop off the keel for inspection).

I'll get a photo of the localised crazing / hair line cracks aft of the lazarette hatch on the starboard side.  (When I tap this area now  I can't hear the difference but maybe I need 20 years of experience).   In any case, the crazing / cracks will be repaired.  The concern is about the risk of trapping in water and how to get the best finish - it look like a simple paint job but matching the faux teak surface and the painted strips in between might be a challenge.

There might already be a thread regarding crazing cracks on the faux teak strips?

Thank you in advance.

John and Mali Morton

Wanderer  ASM283

Auckland NZ


amelforme
 

Hello and good luck with your Amel hunting. I sold that boat to it’s first owner who is a very dear friend. We were very discerning in the original outfitting. 
I also sold it to its second owner who sailed it to  New Zealand and resold it. 
I’ll go through my file on the boat as soon as I get to my warehouse where sold boat files are stored in the next several days and see if I have anything worthwhile to report.

All The Best, Joel

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On May 31, 2018, at 4:00 PM, alin1923@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi. No she does not have a staysail. I will come back with a picture.

Thank you.


Alin Misescu
 

Thank you



From: "Joel Potter jfpottercys@... [amelyachtowners]"
To: amelyachtowners@...
Sent: Friday, 1 June 2018 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] SM 2000 hull 283 delamination on deck

 
Hello and good luck with your Amel hunting. I sold that boat to it’s first owner who is a very dear friend. We were very discerning in the original outfitting. 
I also sold it to its second owner who sailed it to  New Zealand and resold it. 
I’ll go through my file on the boat as soon as I get to my warehouse where sold boat files are stored in the next several days and see if I have anything worthwhile to report.

All The Best, Joel

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On May 31, 2018, at 4:00 PM, alin1923@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 
Hi. No she does not have a staysail. I will come back with a picture.
Thank you.




amelforme
 

Hello Mr. Morton
Were you able to ascertain if the surveyor has surveyed other Amel boats or was this his first Amel inspection? I suspect the later.
I have sold hundreds of second hand Amels and I always shudder when I get a rookie surveyor/expert maritime. The typical snake/mongoose relationship evolves and it becomes very difficult to reasonably demonstrate that many of their assumptions are totally incorrect. Mainly because many surveyors are certain that all brokers are mouth breathing used car salesmen....
To all Amel sellers and especially to Amel buyers, the best Amel surveyor on the planet is Olivier Beauté who was Amel’s technical guru and after sale service honcho. He has forgotten more about Amels than any of us will ever know. If several time zones must be traversed, yep, he will be expensive. But absolutely worth every euro if the boat gives you any reason for pause. In the North American market, I have a guy, soon to retire, that has surveyed 300+ Amels for me. He gets it. Between the two of us, we are close to Olivier’s level of competence. Almost...

A thorough survey by someone familiar with the idiosyncrasies of Amel  boats is the best money you will spend when considering any Amel.

JOEL F. POTTER
CRUISING YACHT SPECIALIST LLC
THE EXPERIENCED AMEL GUY
Office 954-462-5869 

On May 31, 2018, at 4:45 PM, johnericmorton@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Hi Alin and Amel Owners


Just to clarify for other Amel Yacht Owners.  We are selling Wanderer after six great years of proud ownership in NZ.  When the sale goes through we plan to buy an Amel boat in the Mediterranean so we can spend six months each year in NZ then up to six months in the med live on board.  We don't have the appetite to face the challenge of sailing from NZ to Europe.

Alin's surveyor did the woodpecker thing with his light hammer on the deck and marked what he suspected could possibly be small localised areas of delamination requiring further investigation.   The underwater hull all "tapped out" OK.  :)-  and Wanderer otherwise has a clean bill of health.

The Surveyor lost a bit of credibility with me when he commented on "water ingress in the rudder"  (it's hollow by design) and his verbal recommendation to "drop off" the keel so he could check the mild steel attachment bolts.  (They are stainless steel and its not recommended to drop off the keel for inspection).

I'll get a photo of the localised crazing / hair line cracks aft of the lazarette hatch on the starboard side.  (When I tap this area now  I can't hear the difference but maybe I need 20 years of experience).   In any case, the crazing / cracks will be repaired.  The concern is about the risk of trapping in water and how to get the best finish - it look like a simple paint job but matching the faux teak surface and the painted strips in between might be a challenge.

There might already be a thread regarding crazing cracks on the faux teak strips?

Thank you in advance.

John and Mali Morton

Wanderer  ASM283

Auckland NZ


johnericmorton@...
 

Hi Joel

Thank you for your prompt reply and guidance.

There are very few Amels in NZ. I don't think the Surveyor had ever seen an Amel before.......

In this case, I've learnt that it's a bit more complex than a normal condition survey at time of purchase because Alin has in mind possibly taking out paying customers for sailing / diving trips. This means that Wanderer will need to be put "in survey" to the satisfaction of the relevant NZ agency. This is a very rigorous process - any boat going "into survey" must meet the current NZ requirements for design, construction, electrical wiring regulations etc as if the boat is a newly built NZ boat.   Hence there are "norms" such as design checks and approval and dropping down the keel for inspection of the bolts for survey as well as probably pulling out the prop shaft to check condition. All easy to do if the boat is under construction in NZ.  :)-    There is a process for applying for exemptions to these "in survey" requirements.

Fortunately the Electrical Inspector and the Surveyor were impressed with the design, overall quality, fit out, and condition. Good documentation (manuals and the standard drawings / plans) are a big plus for their design checks and their approval for "in survey".

It seems the Surveyor is happy - the results of his  "deck tapping" seems to be advisory only, not a requirement for putting Wanderer "in survey" as a requirement for use for commercial reward.

As there seems to be no history of deck de-lamination issues with Amels, this may be prove to be a red herring, the local Surveyor mentioned possible minor air gap voids at time of construction?    

Perhaps all Amel decks respond with the same beautiful tapping sounds (music to my ears) depending on the location of supports / iron wood / balsa and changes (by design) in materials and thicknesses.


Best Regards


John Morton

Amel Super Maramu #283

Auckland, New Zealand.