[Amel Yacht Owners] keep short poles up?


 

NO.

You will likely chafe your genoa on the elbows of the short pole when close hauled.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970






On Sun, Jun 24, 2018 at 7:12 PM pandmdegroot@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Greetings all,

I have been the owner of SM hull 207 now "la Querida"  formerly "Liebling" for about one year now.  We've been doing weekend off shore sailing based out of Moss Landing, California. The last month we've been working on downwind sailing using the poles, so I've been leaving the short poles in place.

Well today, the jib ripped (tore) on the part of the short pole outboard of the shrouds.  We were doing a routine tack, and the sail was backwinded with some pressure against the shrouds and short pole end.  Upon releasing the sheet we heard the awful ripping sound.

Upon examining the pole end's outside surfaces none were particularly sharp, although the pin was oriented cotter pin outboard.  The ends of the cotter pin were recessed behind the pin end. For me, there were no obvious offending snag points, or sharp edges.

I'm not sure of the age of the jib (130%) but 6 months ago a local sail shop re-covered the leech and foot and said the rest of the sail was in good condition.


So my questions to the group are:

1.  Do you leave the short poles up when not doing downwind sailing?

2.  If the short poles do stay up, is there some additional protection you can recommend.


BTW.  We're loving the SM.  We've been working on upwind and downwind sailing with no autohelm, and no human inputs, just tuning the sails.  She behaves remarkably well.


Thanks in advance,  I read almost all the posts and really appreciate the knowledge,experience and helpfulness of the contributors.


greatketch@...
 

NO...

Like Bill R said, and for another reason...

If you leave the short poles up you can not trim the genoa in tight enough to sail upwind well.  That last 2 or 3 inches will make a HUGE difference in your pointing ability!  Seriously, 10 degrees or more.  

When you are trying to work upwind, details matter.  This is one of the details!

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA


---In amelyachtowners@..., <brouse@...> wrote :

NO.

You will likely chafe your genoa on the elbows of the short pole when close hauled.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970






On Sun, Jun 24, 2018 at 7:12 PM pandmdegroot@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Greetings all,

I have been the owner of SM hull 207 now "la Querida"  formerly "Liebling" for about one year now.  We've been doing weekend off shore sailing based out of Moss Landing, California. The last month we've been working on downwind sailing using the poles, so I've been leaving the short poles in place.

Well today, the jib ripped (tore) on the part of the short pole outboard of the shrouds.  We were doing a routine tack, and the sail was backwinded with some pressure against the shrouds and short pole end.  Upon releasing the sheet we heard the awful ripping sound.

Upon examining the pole end's outside surfaces none were particularly sharp, although the pin was oriented cotter pin outboard.  The ends of the cotter pin were recessed behind the pin end. For me, there were no obvious offending snag points, or sharp edges.

I'm not sure of the age of the jib (130%) but 6 months ago a local sail shop re-covered the leech and foot and said the rest of the sail was in good condition.


So my questions to the group are:

1.  Do you leave the short poles up when not doing downwind sailing?

2.  If the short poles do stay up, is there some additional protection you can recommend.


BTW.  We're loving the SM.  We've been working on upwind and downwind sailing with no autohelm, and no human inputs, just tuning the sails.  She behaves remarkably well.


Thanks in advance,  I read almost all the posts and really appreciate the knowledge,experience and helpfulness of the contributors.


Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi,

Have to agree with Bill Kinney. However it comes down to how long you will be going to windward and when you next need the poles.Do you want to go through the process of putting them up and down often. This can be needed in lumpy sea. It requires care being on deck handling poles in a seaway. I wrap and tape an old towel around the knuckle of the pole if I want to leave them up. I have often thought (but never done) of having soft leather boots made to lace over the knuckles. I think it would be a worthy addition.

Regards

Danny

SM 299 Ocean Pearl

On 25 June 2018 at 15:37 "greatketch@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

NO...


Like Bill R said, and f or another reason...

If you leave the short poles up you can not trim the genoa in tight enough to sail upwind well.  That last 2 or 3 inches will make a HUGE difference in your pointing ability!  Seriously, 10 degrees or more.  

When you are trying to work upwind, details matter.  This is one of the details!

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA


---In amelyachtowners@..., <brouse@...> wrote :

NO.

You will likely chafe your genoa on the elbows of the short pole when close hauled.

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970






On Sun, Jun 24, 2018 at 7:12 PM pandmdegroot@... [amelyachtowners] < amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

 

Greetings all,

I have been the owner of SM hull 207 now "la Querida"  formerly "Liebling" for about one year now.  We've been doing weekend off shore sailing based out of Moss Landing, California. The last month we've been working on downwind sailing using the poles, so I've been leaving the short poles in place.

Well today, the jib ripped (tore) on the part of the short pole outboard of the shrouds.  We were doing a routine tack, and the sail was backwinded with some pressure against the shrouds and short pole end.  Upon releasing the sheet we heard the awful ripping sound.

Upon examining the pole end's outside surfaces none were particularly sharp, although the pin was oriented cotter pin outboard.  The ends of the cotter pin were recessed behind the pin end. For me, there were no obvious offending snag points, or sharp edges.

I'm not sure of the age of the jib (130%) but 6 months ago a local sail shop re-covered the leech and foot and said the rest of the sail was in good condition.


So my questions to the group are:

1.  Do you leave the short poles up when not doing downwind sailing?

2.  If the short poles do stay up, is there some additional protection you can recommend.


BTW.  We're loving the SM.  We've been working on upwind and downwind sailing with no autohelm, and no human inputs, just tuning the sails.  She behaves remarkably well.


Thanks in advance,  I read almost all the posts and really appreciate the knowledge,experience and helpfulness of the contributors.

 

 


 


 


Peter de Groot
 

Hi Danny,
Thanks for your reply.  I'm still in the familiarization stage with the SM doing weekend off shore day sailing.  We're beating upwind for a relatively short down wind sail (heading back to the coast)  Recently I was leaving the short poles up to make it quicker, easier for the down wind leg.
When we head to Mexico (hopefully 2020) we'll  make judgments based on longer periods of relatively consistent wind direction.  I may revisit the towel or leather idea at that time.  For now the poles will be coming down.

Thanks
Peter de Groot
La Querida SM207


Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Peter,

There was a famous new Zealand around the world racing sailor name of Peter Blake. His advice: off shore never sail close hauled, (racing or cruising) crack sheets and enjoy the better sea motion, speed and comfort, because the wind will change. Put it another way, don't fight to stay on the rhumb line take the easier passage, the wind will change. I'm talking long inter-island passages and trans ocean stuff. As a fervent erstwhile racing yachtsman it took me quite a while to come to grips with this. Against all my instincts, but I promise you PB was right. Back to the towels or soft leather protectors on the poles. With the best will in the world there will be times when your sail will make contact. Why not apply this simple protection. Makes more sense than wear patches on the sail.

Kind Regards

Danny Simms

On 26 June 2018 at 15:16 "pandmdegroot@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi Danny,
Thanks for your reply.  I'm still in the familiarization stage with the SM doing weekend off shore day sailing.  We're beating upwind for a relatively short down wind sail (heading back to the coast)  Recently I was leaving the short poles up to make it quicker, easier for the down wind leg.
When we head to Mexico (hopefully 2020) we'll  make judgments based on longer periods of relatively consistent wind direction.  I may revisit the towel or leather idea at that time.  For now the poles will be coming down.

Thanks
Peter de Groot
La Querida SM207