[Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor Chain twisted in the locker after using some times


 

Ruedi,

Your Amel should have a Wasi Power Ball swivel at the connection between the chain and anchor. Does it?

Also, 10mm chain and gypsies come in 2 different sized links, called pitch. Carefully measure the long inside dimension of several links. Then inspect the gypsy for all markings. Let me know what you find. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 06:01 Rudolf@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Dear Amelias


On my Amel-54 I have original setup, as I think (Buegel-Anchor, WASI Powerball, Lewmar Windlass V4/V5).


I found a strange behavior of the anchor-chain which is after 8-10 Anchor maneuvers very badly twisted in the chain locker. It happened that when I need to draw more chain (let say over 40m) the chain is blocking in the windlass, because of this heavy twist in the locker. From time to time I take out the 100m chain and un-twist to avoid blockage, but still then after maybe 50-60m the twist coms back after short usage. 


Anchor chain 10mm Stainless-Steel (brand unknown) was replaced by former owner 2 years ago. The gypsy looks good, used but not damaged (I have not much experience how it must look like ;-) The V4/5 Gypsy No.203 (10mm) is correct. The chain works well in the windlass (also Swivel), and it seems all is matching.  

 

I ask you experienced guys who may had the similar problem, or who could know the cause of the twisted chain? 


- Is the gypsy of the windlass defect or over-used to much?

- Is the Stainless-Steel chain of a bad quality?

- Could the chain twist if it is not 100% match, it seems to match, but ?? 

- Any other idea for this strange behavior?

 

Thanks for advice and best regards

Ruedi

WASABI 

A54-#55

Gouvia, Korfu

 


Rudolf Waldispuehl
 

Bill

Yes, I have the WASI Power ball swivel installed. 

Here the measurements, the long inside of a link is something between 27.8 mm and 28mm. Hard to measure, but I think it’s 28mm.

The Gypsy is marked 203. 
This is what AMEL originally delivered I think (Lewmar V5 with 203 Gypsy), isn’t it?

Thanks for your great support. 
Best 
Ruedi 

WASABI A-54#55


Von: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Antworten an: <amelyachtowners@...>
Datum: Freitag, 17. August 2018 um 15:46
An: <amelyachtowners@...>
Betreff: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor Chain twisted in the locker after using some times

 

Ruedi,

Your Amel should have a Wasi Power Ball swivel at the connection between the chain and anchor. Does it?

Also, 10mm chain and gypsies come in 2 different sized links, called pitch. Carefully measure the long inside dimension of several links. Then inspect the gypsy for all markings. Let me know what you find. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 06:01 Rudolf@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Dear Amelias


On my Amel-54 I have original setup, as I think (Buegel-Anchor, WASI Powerball, Lewmar Windlass V4/V5).


I found a strange behavior of the anchor-chain which is after 8-10 Anchor maneuvers very badly twisted in the chain locker. It happened that when I need to draw more chain (let say over 40m) the chain is blocking in the windlass, because of this heavy twist in the locker. From time to time I take out the 100m chain and un-twist to avoid blockage, but still then after maybe 50-60m the twist coms back after short usage. 


Anchor chain 10mm Stainless-Steel (brand unknown) was replaced by former owner 2 years ago. The gypsy looks good, used but not damaged (I have not much experience how it must look like ;-) The V4/5 Gypsy No.203 (10mm) is correct. The chain works well in the windlass (also Swivel), and it seems all is matching.  

 

I ask you experienced guys who may had the similar problem, or who could know the cause of the twisted chain? 


- Is the gypsy of the windlass defect or over-used to much?

- Is the Stainless-Steel chain of a bad quality?

- Could the chain twist if it is not 100% match, it seems to match, but ?? 

- Any other idea for this strange behavior?

 

Thanks for advice and best regards

Ruedi

WASABI 

A54-#55

Gouvia, Korfu

 


 

Rueidi,

I believe that I have bad news for you.

The "ISO standard" 10mm chain has a "pitch" of 30mm and the "DIN standard" 10mm chain has a pitch of 28mm.

Pitch is the distance inside the chain loop on the long side. I privately emailed you a page from my Amel Book which explains this.

Here is the bad news:
The Lewmar V5 with 203 Gypsy is "ISO standard" for 10mm chain and is designed for a "pitch" of 30mm. Amel always installs ISO Standard chain.
The Stainless Steel chain on your boat is "DIN standard" with a pitch of 28mm.
This will cause multiple problems including the one you described.

You need new gypsies for DIN standard 10mm chain.

The error the previous owner made is a common mistake, and it is never, ever checked by surveyors. My guess is that this email to you will ne "news" to many Amel owners. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 11:25 AM Rudolf Waldispuehl Rudolf@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill

Yes, I have the WASI Power ball swivel installed. 

Here the measurements, the long inside of a link is something between 27.8 mm and 28mm. Hard to measure, but I think it’s 28mm.

The Gypsy is marked 203. 
This is what AMEL originally delivered I think (Lewmar V5 with 203 Gypsy), isn’t it?

Thanks for your great support. 
Best 
Ruedi 

WASABI A-54#55


Von: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Antworten an: <amelyachtowners@...>
Datum: Freitag, 17. August 2018 um 15:46
An: <amelyachtowners@...>
Betreff: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor Chain twisted in the locker after using some times

 

Ruedi,

Your Amel should have a Wasi Power Ball swivel at the connection between the chain and anchor. Does it?

Also, 10mm chain and gypsies come in 2 different sized links, called pitch. Carefully measure the long inside dimension of several links. Then inspect the gypsy for all markings. Let me know what you find. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 06:01 Rudolf@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Dear Amelias


On my Amel-54 I have original setup, as I think (Buegel-Anchor, WASI Powerball, Lewmar Windlass V4/V5).


I found a strange behavior of the anchor-chain which is after 8-10 Anchor maneuvers very badly twisted in the chain locker. It happened that when I need to draw more chain (let say over 40m) the chain is blocking in the windlass, because of this heavy twist in the locker. From time to time I take out the 100m chain and un-twist to avoid blockage, but still then after maybe 50-60m the twist coms back after short usage. 


Anchor chain 10mm Stainless-Steel (brand unknown) was replaced by former owner 2 years ago. The gypsy looks good, used but not damaged (I have not much experience how it must look like ;-) The V4/5 Gypsy No.203 (10mm) is correct. The chain works well in the windlass (also Swivel), and it seems all is matching.  

 

I ask you experienced guys who may had the similar problem, or who could know the cause of the twisted chain? 


- Is the gypsy of the windlass defect or over-used to much?

- Is the Stainless-Steel chain of a bad quality?

- Could the chain twist if it is not 100% match, it seems to match, but ?? 

- Any other idea for this strange behavior?

 

Thanks for advice and best regards

Ruedi

WASABI 

A54-#55

Gouvia, Korfu

 


Rudolf Waldispuehl
 

Thank you Bill

You are a great resource as always. If I ever meet you I will buy you some beers ;-)
I was close on same track but I had no evidence about the Problem. I'm not happy to buy new gypsy's but I'm happy to know the source of the Problem now.

Found the Details also in the Lewmar manual in pdf on Page35:


Thanks  and cheers
Ruedi


On 17 Aug 2018, at 20:05, Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Rueidi,

I believe that I have bad news for you.

The "ISO standard" 10mm chain has a "pitch" of 30mm and the "DIN standard" 10mm chain has a pitch of 28mm.

Pitch is the distance inside the chain loop on the long side. I privately emailed you a page from my Amel Book which explains this.

Here is the bad news:
The Lewmar V5 with 203 Gypsy is "ISO standard" for 10mm chain and is designed for a "pitch" of 30mm. Amel always installs ISO Standard chain.
The Stainless Steel chain on your boat is "DIN standard" with a pitch of 28mm.
This will cause multiple problems including the one you described.

You need new gypsies for DIN standard 10mm chain.

The error the previous owner made is a common mistake, and it is never, ever checked by surveyors. My guess is that this email to you will ne "news" to many Amel owners. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus

Amel School  http://www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550

+1(832) 380-4970

Any opinions and conclusions expressed in this message are solely those of the author and should not be construed as representing the opinion of an expert. Manufacturers' and Expert's precautions must be considered when dealing with mechanical and/or electrical systems to ensure that you are NOT harmed, and/or the device and/or system is NOT ruined. If in doubt, do not touch any mechanical and/or electrical device or system referred to above.


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018 at 11:25 AM Rudolf Waldispuehl Rudolf@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Bill

Yes, I have the WASI Power ball swivel installed. 

Here the measurements, the long inside of a link is something between 27.8 mm and 28mm. Hard to measure, but I think it’s 28mm.

The Gypsy is marked 203. 
This is what AMEL originally delivered I think (Lewmar V5 with 203 Gypsy), isn’t it?

Thanks for your great support. 
Best 
Ruedi 

WASABI A-54#55


Von: <amelyachtowners@...> on behalf of "Bill Rouse brouse@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...>
Antworten an: <amelyachtowners@...>
Datum: Freitag, 17. August 2018 um 15:46
An: <amelyachtowners@...>
Betreff: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Anchor Chain twisted in the locker after using some times

 

Ruedi,

Your Amel should have a Wasi Power Ball swivel at the connection between the chain and anchor. Does it?

Also, 10mm chain and gypsies come in 2 different sized links, called pitch. Carefully measure the long inside dimension of several links. Then inspect the gypsy for all markings. Let me know what you find. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse
Admiral, Texas Navy
Commander Emeritus
Amel School www.amelschool.com
720 Winnie St
Galveston Island, TX 77550
+1(832) 380-4970


On Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 06:01 Rudolf@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Dear Amelias


On my Amel-54 I have original setup, as I think (Buegel-Anchor, WASI Powerball, Lewmar Windlass V4/V5).


I found a strange behavior of the anchor-chain which is after 8-10 Anchor maneuvers very badly twisted in the chain locker. It happened that when I need to draw more chain (let say over 40m) the chain is blocking in the windlass, because of this heavy twist in the locker. From time to time I take out the 100m chain and un-twist to avoid blockage, but still then after maybe 50-60m the twist coms back after short usage. 


Anchor chain 10mm Stainless-Steel (brand unknown) was replaced by former owner 2 years ago. The gypsy looks good, used but not damaged (I have not much experience how it must look like ;-) The V4/5 Gypsy No.203 (10mm) is correct. The chain works well in the windlass (also Swivel), and it seems all is matching.  

 

I ask you experienced guys who may had the similar problem, or who could know the cause of the twisted chain? 


- Is the gypsy of the windlass defect or over-used to much?

- Is the Stainless-Steel chain of a bad quality?

- Could the chain twist if it is not 100% match, it seems to match, but ?? 

- Any other idea for this strange behavior?

 

Thanks for advice and best regards

Ruedi

WASABI 

A54-#55

Gouvia, Korfu

 


greatketch@...
 

As Bill R points out, varying chain standards are very frequently a source of trouble.

The best advice I received was is to always take the gypsy along with you when buying chain, and make SURE that the new chain lies perfectly in the wheel.  Not close... perfect.  

Do not trust the vendor, or the markings.  Test the fit.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA
 


Rudolf Waldispuehl
 

Thank you Bill & Bill 
I learned a lot about ISO and DIN chains, - what the former owner unfortunately was not aware when he ordered a new Stainless Steel Chain in 2014!
Hope I can get the 202 Type Gypsy from Lewmar.
Cheers
Ruedi
SY WASABI

On 17 Aug 2018, at 23:33, greatketch@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

As Bill R points out, varying chain standards are very frequently a source of trouble.


The best advice I received was is to always take the gypsy along with you when buying chain, and make SURE that the new chain lies perfectly in the wheel.  Not close... perfect.  

Do not trust the vendor, or the markings.  Test the fit.

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Annapolis, MD, USA