Jordan Drogue


eric freedman
 

Hi,

With respect to the Jordan Drogue it is now available in spectra—that is the way to go. It was originally developed by Don Jordan and manufactured by Dave Pelissier of Ace Sailmakers in Connecticut—I would order it from him  and only him.

There are many people now selling the drogue and a few that I have seen are shoddy.

 

If you are feeling really nautical you can buy the kit from him with pre-assembled cones and weave it together yourself.  If you do not get it from Ace, Make sure that the forward facing edge of the cones have seams on them otherwise they will shred after many hours in the water. See above photo.

 

 

When I had Kimberlite built I had Amel Super reinforce the stern cleats. At the end of my bridles I also have large loops spliced into them.

To keep from putting strain on one back stay (you only will have to adjust one leg)  I had a machine shop make me a titanium Humongous snatch block for 1 ½ inch line. Which I will fasten to a few places on the deck fittings to square the boat to the waves.

 

You might also want to have the vinyl covering for the cockpit (weather cloths) zippers modified. I had my sailmaker put loops on either side of the zipper every foot and a half so if the zipper starts coming apart you can tie it back together.

 

When bringing in the drogue you will need something bolted to the stern chocks as the drogue wants to get caught on it and tear the cones.

The drogue has to be tailed by hand as it is  too big for the winch.

Careful not to tear the cones on the winch line stripper.

 

Lastly, the winch motor will cut out after about 4 minutes due to thermal overload. Either bring in the drogue a bit, wait for the motor to cool off and proceed or wait till the overload device trips and then wait 5 minutes and it will work again.

 

I hope it never leaves your port locker.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

From: carpathia3 via groups.io [mailto:carpathia3@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2019 10:23 AM
To: eric freedman
Subject: Private: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Gearbox greasing

 

Hi Eric,

Thank you for your response, very clear! And yes, I would like to attend to the shaft as well... Just not sure I will be able to take it out. I may have to construct a tool like Jose's to remove it. Mine has probably never been serviced in 19 years so I expect the worst...

I know you are also a big fan of the Jordan drogue and I am quite interested in having one on Carpathia. Can I ask you for your latest advice on how to fit it well with the backstays, and what you found the best setup on the SM. Any picture would help too...

Many thanks,

Guillaume

 


Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Eric,

I know you believe in the drogue method of storm tactics but your description of your boat preparation and handling systems confirms my negativity to the system. The number of things to potentially go wrong is scary. Also It places the boat stern on to the breaking seas and that results in those seas breaking into the boat and filling the cockpit with water. I remember you saying that the crew in the cockpit was up to their armpits in water. I will stay with my bow deployed sea anchor. The front facing parts of the boat are designed to take attacks by the sea which the stern is not. (In my opinion.)

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 28 February 2019 at 17:35 eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi,

With respect to the Jordan Drogue it is now available in spectra—that is the way to go. It was originally developed by Don Jordan and manufactured by Dave Pelissier of Ace Sailmakers in Connecticut—I would order it from him  and only him.

There are many people now selling the drogue and a few that I have seen are shoddy.

 

If you are feeling really nautical you can buy the kit from him with pre-assembled cones and weave it together yourself.  If you do not get it from Ace, Make sure that the forward facing edge of the cones have seams on them otherwise they will shred after many hours in the water. See above photo.

 

 

When I had Kimberlite built I had Amel Super reinforce the stern cleats. At the end of my bridles I also have large loops spliced into them.

To keep from putting strain on one back stay (you only will have to adjust one leg)  I had a machine shop make me a titanium Humongous snatch block for 1 ½ inch line. Which I will fasten to a few places on the deck fittings to square the boat to the waves.

 

You might also want to have the vinyl covering for the cockpit (weather cloths) zippers modified. I had my sailmaker put loops on either side of the zipper every foot and a half so if the zipper starts coming apart you can tie it back together.

 

When bringing in the drogue you will need something bolted to the stern chocks as the drogue wants to get caught on it and tear the cones.

The drogue has to be tailed by hand as it is  too big for the winch.

Careful not to tear the cones on the winch line stripper.

 

Lastly, the winch motor will cut out after about 4 minutes due to thermal overload. Either bring in the drogue a bit, wait for the motor to cool off and proceed or wait till the overload device trips and then wait 5 minutes and it will work again.

 

I hope it never leaves your port locker.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

From: carpathia3 via groups.io [mailto:carpathia3@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2019 10:23 AM
To: eric freedman
Subject: Private: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Gearbox greasing

 

Hi Eric,

Thank you for your response, very clear! And yes, I would like to attend to the shaft as well... Just not sure I will be able to take it out. I may have to construct a tool like Jose's to remove it. Mine has probably never been serviced in 19 years so I expect the worst...

I know you are also a big fan of the Jordan drogue and I am quite interested in having one on Carpathia. Can I ask you for your latest advice on how to fit it well with the backstays, and what you found the best setup on the SM. Any picture would help too...

Many thanks,

Guillaume

 


 


 


James Alton
 

The sea anchor option has many benefits, some of which you mentioned but it also has one big potential problem.  It is possible under certain conditions to develop significant sternway while riding to a sea anchor and the potential exists for rudders to be damaged or destroyed.   The Amel rudders seem to be quite stout so perhaps they could handle more stress than an average sailboat but this would still be a concern to me in very extreme conditions.  If anyone has been on a sea anchor with an Amel in extreme conditions, I would certainly be interested to hear your story.  

One other concern I have with the sea anchor option is the lack of manuverabilty should another vessel approach or the boat be driven towards some danger.  With the drogue off the stern you should have some control of direction without having to recover or detach from the drogue.  Certainly an interesting area of discussion.

Best,

James
SV Sueno
Maramu #220

On Feb 28, 2019, at 12:31 PM, Danny and Yvonne SIMMS <simms@...> wrote:

Hi Eric,

I know you believe in the drogue method of storm tactics but your description of your boat preparation and handling systems confirms my negativity to the system. The number of things to potentially go wrong is scary. Also It places the boat stern on to the breaking seas and that results in those seas breaking into the boat and filling the cockpit with water. I remember you saying that the crew in the cockpit was up to their armpits in water. I will stay with my bow deployed sea anchor. The front facing parts of the boat are designed to take attacks by the sea which the stern is not. (In my opinion.)

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 28 February 2019 at 17:35 eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi,

With respect to the Jordan Drogue it is now available in spectra—that is the way to go. It was originally developed by Don Jordan and manufactured by Dave Pelissier of Ace Sailmakers in Connecticut—I would order it from him  and only him.

There are many people now selling the drogue and a few that I have seen are shoddy.

 

If you are feeling really nautical you can buy the kit from him with pre-assembled cones and weave it together yourself.  If you do not get it from Ace, Make sure that the forward facing edge of the cones have seams on them otherwise they will shred after many hours in the water. See above photo.

 

 

When I had Kimberlite built I had Amel Super reinforce the stern cleats. At the end of my bridles I also have large loops spliced into them.

To keep from putting strain on one back stay (you only will have to adjust one leg)  I had a machine shop make me a titanium Humongous snatch block for 1 ½ inch line. Which I will fasten to a few places on the deck fittings to square the boat to the waves.

 

You might also want to have the vinyl covering for the cockpit (weather cloths) zippers modified. I had my sailmaker put loops on either side of the zipper every foot and a half so if the zipper starts coming apart you can tie it back together.

 

When bringing in the drogue you will need something bolted to the stern chocks as the drogue wants to get caught on it and tear the cones.

The drogue has to be tailed by hand as it is  too big for the winch.

Careful not to tear the cones on the winch line stripper.

 

Lastly, the winch motor will cut out after about 4 minutes due to thermal overload. Either bring in the drogue a bit, wait for the motor to cool off and proceed or wait till the overload device trips and then wait 5 minutes and it will work again.

 

I hope it never leaves your port locker.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

From: carpathia3 via groups.io [mailto:carpathia3@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2019 10:23 AM
To: eric freedman
Subject: Private: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Gearbox greasing

 

Hi Eric,

Thank you for your response, very clear! And yes, I would like to attend to the shaft as well... Just not sure I will be able to take it out. I may have to construct a tool like Jose's to remove it. Mine has probably never been serviced in 19 years so I expect the worst...

I know you are also a big fan of the Jordan drogue and I am quite interested in having one on Carpathia. Can I ask you for your latest advice on how to fit it well with the backstays, and what you found the best setup on the SM. Any picture would help too...

Many thanks,

Guillaume

 


 


 



Mark McGovern
 

James,

Eric Freedman of Kimberlite wrote this article about using a Jordan Drogue on his Super Maramu:  http://www.oceannavigator.com/March-April-2011/Prepare-for-survival-conditions/

You can also search this forum for "Jordan Drogue" and you will find several discussions.

--
Mark McGovern
SM #440 Cara
Deale, MD USA


eric freedman
 

Hi Danny,

I don’t recall numerous problems with the Jordan the few times I have launched it. I believe with a bow mounted drag device, if a big wave is breaking you are going to get pooped..

How did your sea anchor work in Hurricane conditions?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2019 12:32 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan Drogue

 

Hi Eric,

I know you believe in the drogue method of storm tactics but your description of your boat preparation and handling systems confirms my negativity to the system. The number of things to potentially go wrong is scary. Also It places the boat stern on to the breaking seas and that results in those seas breaking into the boat and filling the cockpit with water. I remember you saying that the crew in the cockpit was up to their armpits in water. I will stay with my bow deployed sea anchor. The front facing parts of the boat are designed to take attacks by the sea which the stern is not. (In my opinion.)

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 28 February 2019 at 17:35 eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi,

With respect to the Jordan Drogue it is now available in spectra—that is the way to go. It was originally developed by Don Jordan and manufactured by Dave Pelissier of Ace Sailmakers in Connecticut—I would order it from him  and only him.

There are many people now selling the drogue and a few that I have seen are shoddy.

 

If you are feeling really nautical you can buy the kit from him with pre-assembled cones and weave it together yourself.  If you do not get it from Ace, Make sure that the forward facing edge of the cones have seams on them otherwise they will shred after many hours in the water. See above photo.

 

 

When I had Kimberlite built I had Amel Super reinforce the stern cleats. At the end of my bridles I also have large loops spliced into them.

To keep from putting strain on one back stay (you only will have to adjust one leg)  I had a machine shop make me a titanium Humongous snatch block for 1 ½ inch line. Which I will fasten to a few places on the deck fittings to square the boat to the waves.

 

You might also want to have the vinyl covering for the cockpit (weather cloths) zippers modified. I had my sailmaker put loops on either side of the zipper every foot and a half so if the zipper starts coming apart you can tie it back together.

 

When bringing in the drogue you will need something bolted to the stern chocks as the drogue wants to get caught on it and tear the cones.

The drogue has to be tailed by hand as it is  too big for the winch.

Careful not to tear the cones on the winch line stripper.

 

Lastly, the winch motor will cut out after about 4 minutes due to thermal overload. Either bring in the drogue a bit, wait for the motor to cool off and proceed or wait till the overload device trips and then wait 5 minutes and it will work again.

 

I hope it never leaves your port locker.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

From: carpathia3 via groups.io [mailto:carpathia3@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2019 10:23 AM
To: eric freedman
Subject: Private: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Gearbox greasing

 

Hi Eric,

Thank you for your response, very clear! And yes, I would like to attend to the shaft as well... Just not sure I will be able to take it out. I may have to construct a tool like Jose's to remove it. Mine has probably never been serviced in 19 years so I expect the worst...

I know you are also a big fan of the Jordan drogue and I am quite interested in having one on Carpathia. Can I ask you for your latest advice on how to fit it well with the backstays, and what you found the best setup on the SM. Any picture would help too...

Many thanks,

Guillaume

 


 


 


eric freedman
 

Danny,

Before deciding on the Jordan for my first offshore boat I read the DDDB Drag Device Data book about sea anchors and drogues. My conclusion was to go with the Jordan.

I just pulled out the book and found a quote that I remembered from a boat using a 18 foot para anchor in

Force 9-10 winds . “as each monster wave approached. Celtic would back up like a retreating Muhammed Ali against a charging  Joe Frazier and let the impact roll under her. Huge waves would break on us and roll over the deck darkening the cabin with its green water. (page 3.1.45)

 

My other concern was that on a sea anchor you are going backwards. I don’t know what effect that would have on the rudder over an extended period of time.

I recall that quote to this day .

 

If you look at article below   the video in the attached link towards the middle of the article you will see the coast guard rescue of a few sailors from an upturned Swan about 160 miles closer to land than we were . If you look carefully you will see the men in the water in the night, At 2 minutes 30 seconds you will see the coast guard returning to retrieve the deceased captain. The chopper was hovering at 100 feet and you will see the chopper almost going into that wave. The boat was closer to shore so the winds and the wave heights were less than what we encountered..

I have now had the drogue out 3 times on 2 different boats and I hope it just sits in its bag and dies of green mold.

 

I have fabricated a wood block that bolts over the stern cleats so no more problem of ripping the cones there.

 

In the future, I plan on moving the SB antenna a few feet forward and then I can run the drogue bridle outside the backstays and that will solve all my issues.

 

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

http://lifefloatingby.blogspot.com/2008/10/coast-guard-rescues-2-mt-pleasant.html)

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2019 4:56 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan Drogue

 

Hi Danny,

I don’t recall numerous problems with the Jordan the few times I have launched it. I believe with a bow mounted drag device, if a big wave is breaking you are going to get pooped..

How did your sea anchor work in Hurricane conditions?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2019 12:32 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan Drogue

 

Hi Eric,

I know you believe in the drogue method of storm tactics but your description of your boat preparation and handling systems confirms my negativity to the system. The number of things to potentially go wrong is scary. Also It places the boat stern on to the breaking seas and that results in those seas breaking into the boat and filling the cockpit with water. I remember you saying that the crew in the cockpit was up to their armpits in water. I will stay with my bow deployed sea anchor. The front facing parts of the boat are designed to take attacks by the sea which the stern is not. (In my opinion.)

Kind Regards

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 28 February 2019 at 17:35 eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:

Hi,

With respect to the Jordan Drogue it is now available in spectra—that is the way to go. It was originally developed by Don Jordan and manufactured by Dave Pelissier of Ace Sailmakers in Connecticut—I would order it from him  and only him.

There are many people now selling the drogue and a few that I have seen are shoddy.

 

If you are feeling really nautical you can buy the kit from him with pre-assembled cones and weave it together yourself.  If you do not get it from Ace, Make sure that the forward facing edge of the cones have seams on them otherwise they will shred after many hours in the water. See above photo.

 

 

When I had Kimberlite built I had Amel Super reinforce the stern cleats. At the end of my bridles I also have large loops spliced into them.

To keep from putting strain on one back stay (you only will have to adjust one leg)  I had a machine shop make me a titanium Humongous snatch block for 1 ½ inch line. Which I will fasten to a few places on the deck fittings to square the boat to the waves.

 

You might also want to have the vinyl covering for the cockpit (weather cloths) zippers modified. I had my sailmaker put loops on either side of the zipper every foot and a half so if the zipper starts coming apart you can tie it back together.

 

When bringing in the drogue you will need something bolted to the stern chocks as the drogue wants to get caught on it and tear the cones.

The drogue has to be tailed by hand as it is  too big for the winch.

Careful not to tear the cones on the winch line stripper.

 

Lastly, the winch motor will cut out after about 4 minutes due to thermal overload. Either bring in the drogue a bit, wait for the motor to cool off and proceed or wait till the overload device trips and then wait 5 minutes and it will work again.

 

I hope it never leaves your port locker.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

From: carpathia3 via groups.io [mailto:carpathia3@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2019 10:23 AM
To: eric freedman
Subject: Private: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Gearbox greasing

 

Hi Eric,

Thank you for your response, very clear! And yes, I would like to attend to the shaft as well... Just not sure I will be able to take it out. I may have to construct a tool like Jose's to remove it. Mine has probably never been serviced in 19 years so I expect the worst...

I know you are also a big fan of the Jordan drogue and I am quite interested in having one on Carpathia. Can I ask you for your latest advice on how to fit it well with the backstays, and what you found the best setup on the SM. Any picture would help too...

Many thanks,

Guillaume