Topics

Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network


Stefan Schaufert
 

Dear Amelians,

 

thanks to Ken (SV Aquarius) and Oliver (SV Nautica) and others we know there are good (stand alone or B&G) solutions for a forward looking sonar.

 

But do you know a possibility/ device which is able to use the Furuno NavNet (Radar) Plotter (yes, it is old, but working reliable) for showing the „pictures“? 

 

Thanks for your hints.

 

Best regards

Stefan

A54 #119 Lady Charlyette, currently/ still in Aruba


Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hello Stefan,

Just a note..

The Interphase sonar is stand alone and the screen is mounted on the cockpit side by the left arm of the helmsman.

I went to a different solution when I replaced the electronics on Eleuthera; I chose the Raymarine unit as it integrates totally with the rest of the system.  Our system works well but restricted to about 2.5 knots of speed.  The Interphase is also limited in speed but given that you only use the system in shallow or doubtful waters, most skippers will be going slowly anyway.

Good luck

Jean-Pierre Germain



On 28 Sep 2020, at 10:29, Stefan Schaufert <mail@...> wrote:

Dear Amelians,

 

thanks to Ken (SV Aquarius) and Oliver (SV Nautica) and others we know there are good (stand alone or B&G) solutions for a forward looking sonar.

 

But do you know a possibility/ device which is able to use the Furuno NavNet (Radar) Plotter (yes, it is old, but working reliable) for showing the „pictures“? 

 

Thanks for your hints.

 

Best regards

Stefan

A54 #119 Lady Charlyette, currently/ still in Aruba



Arno Luijten
 

Hi Stefan,

Actually the B&G version got some pretty bad press. I have no first hand experience so I cannot confirm.
If your plotter supports video-in you could consider this one: https://echopilot.com/products/fls-platinum-engine/

This company has been working on this stuff for quite some time and what I've seen they get pretty decent reviews.

Kind regards,

Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Paul Osterberg
 

I thinking of  install an Echopilot but can't find the real performance difference between the Platinum an the FLS 2D, the Platinum cost about 1500 € and has no screen and NMA0183 and video S  so can be connected to a MFD given it has an Video S port. the FLS cost 1200 € and has it' own screen. Looks like the FLS is better value but ....
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Mark Erdos
 

Paul,

 

I have a forward looking sonar. It came with the boat. I have used it only a handful of times in the San Blas Islands and now in French Poly. It is a very expensive item that can easily be substituted by a person on the bow.

 

Just my 2 cents but I think you are better off reading the water colors and with a bow lookout rather than relying on a monitor. IMO - The technology is iffy, at best. I certainly wouldn’t risk my vessel based on the display. The distance the sonar looks forward is very dependent on the depth. In other words, if in shallow water, the distance forward looking is very minimal. Chances are you will hit whatever is in front of you in shallow water if relying on the sonar. I found it to be more of a distraction rather than an aid. Again, just my 2¢.

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Paul Osterberg
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2020 8:15 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

 

I thinking of  install an Echopilot but can't find the real performance difference between the Platinum an the FLS 2D, the Platinum cost about 1500 € and has no screen and NMA0183 and video S  so can be connected to a MFD given it has an Video S port. the FLS cost 1200 € and has it' own screen. Looks like the FLS is better value but ....
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 
Edited

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 


Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes an FLS will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water.  I have had times when I was not able to get the depth for up to 5 minutes in some areas..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262


James Alton
 

Ken,

   A great educated/ personal review of FLS.   Your logic concerning the value and useage of FLS seems sound to me.  This is timely as I am looking at adding FLS to our boat.  Recognizing that this seems to be a still developing technology, may I ask you if you feel that the unit that you have installed on Aquarius is the best unit to consider?

Stay safe and keep having fun out there! We have really enjoyed your videos.

James and Joann
SV Sueno
Maramu #220


-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Sep 29, 2020 5:14 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 

Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes they will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water sometimes I was not able to get the depth for unto 5 minutes or so..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262


Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hello Gang,

When I decided to integrate an FLS, I chose a Raymarine unit.  Integrates perfectly with the rest of the electronics and displays on either of my 2 plotters.

Additionally, having sailed in close company for many days, I would say Raymarine system compares favourably with Interphase with good data reception up to 2.5 knots SOG.  Obviously, the same restrictions apply in waters obscured by sediments etc.

Kind regards,


Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, SM007, Opua, NZ




On 29 Sep 2020, at 07:14, Paul Osterberg <osterberg.paul.l@...> wrote:

I thinking of  install an Echopilot but can't find the real performance difference between the Platinum an the FLS 2D, the Platinum cost about 1500 € and has no screen and NMA0183 and video S  so can be connected to a MFD given it has an Video S port. the FLS cost 1200 € and has it' own screen. Looks like the FLS is better value but ....
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Hello James,

I like the fact that the Echo Pilot is completely separate from the rest of the navigation equipment.  I would like a radar overlay on the chart plotter, but not the FLS.  You can spend more to have an integrated system, but I'm not sure it's useful for the FLS.  When I am in shallow water, I have the Echo Pilot going, and a few maps running.  Got my airplane pilot scan going, 1sec per screen, and then out of the cockpit... and repeat.  The FLS is just one of the inputs.  

Is this the best?  That, I could not say, because this is all I know.  Echo Pilot is easy to install, easy to use, and easy to set up.  Once set up, if the FLS needs more than an on off button that's too much.  For this reason, It's the best for me.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262


Mark Erdos
 

You may find this a good read:

 

 

https://www.pbo.co.uk/gear/5-forward-looking-sonar-tested-29321

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 


Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hi Ken,

Good to see your usage of FLS is like mine; like everything else electronic, what is really needed?

I have hit the reef twice; lightly in both cases... in Fiji.  First time was in a buoyed channel near northern Taveuni and it was reported to Navionics as it was not shown on any chart and the second time was on exit from Fulanga with a 5 knot following current.  Just a glancing hit.  Reported to Navionics as well.  Perhaps added to their database by now.

Greets to Z.  Stay safe.


Jean-Pierre Germain



On 30 Sep 2020, at 04:44, Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

Hello James,

I like the fact that the Echo Pilot is completely separate from the rest of the navigation equipment.  I would like a radar overlay on the chart plotter, but not the FLS.  You can spend more to have an integrated system, but I'm not sure it's useful for the FLS.  When I am in shallow water, I have the Echo Pilot going, and a few maps running.  Got my airplane pilot scan going, 1sec per screen, and then out of the cockpit... and repeat.  The FLS is just one of the inputs.  

Is this the best?  That, I could not say, because this is all I know.  Echo Pilot is easy to install, easy to use, and easy to set up.  Once set up, if the FLS needs more than an on off button that's too much.  For this reason, It's the best for me.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262


James Alton
 

Ken,

     I was originally thinking of something that would interface with my B&G display but I think that you make a really good point about having a stand alone system in this case.  It helps a lot to hear from someone like yourself that has a lot of recent experience with a product, so thank you for sharing.  Easy and simple have a lot of value in my book as well so I will take a good hard look at the Echo Pilot option.  

Fair winds to you both,

James and Joann Alton
SV Sueno
Maramu #220



-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Sep 29, 2020 11:44 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Hello James,

I like the fact that the Echo Pilot is completely separate from the rest of the navigation equipment.  I would like a radar overlay on the chart plotter, but not the FLS.  You can spend more to have an integrated system, but I'm not sure it's useful for the FLS.  When I am in shallow water, I have the Echo Pilot going, and a few maps running.  Got my airplane pilot scan going, 1sec per screen, and then out of the cockpit... and repeat.  The FLS is just one of the inputs.  

Is this the best?  That, I could not say, because this is all I know.  Echo Pilot is easy to install, easy to use, and easy to set up.  Once set up, if the FLS needs more than an on off button that's too much.  For this reason, It's the best for me.

Ken
Aquarius SM2K#262


Paul Osterberg
 

Jean-Pierre!
What transducer did you choose, I though Raymarine was mor for fish finding?
Paul on SY Kerpa SM#259


Justin Paulsen
 

Ken,

Did you know that they have a video of Aquarius on the Echo Pilot website?

It is right under the "Get Quote" button on this page:  https://echopilot.com/products/fls-2d/

- Justin
Hopeful future SM/SM2k owner


On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 10:50 AM Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 


Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes an FLS will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water.  I have had times when I was not able to get the depth for up to 5 minutes in some areas..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262



--
Justin Paulsen
IT Professional

"The world is open, are you?"


Ian Townsend
 

We had an EchoPilot on our SM until it died two years ago. We wanted to replace it and talked with all the major electronics manufacturers, none of whom seemed enthused by the technology. So we have been without it since then including spending a lot of time in shallow and reef-laden waters. We don't miss it.

Ian
SM153
Loca Lola II



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Mark Erdos <mcerdos@...>
Date: 2020-09-29 12:06 (GMT-05:00)
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

You may find this a good read:

 

 

https://www.pbo.co.uk/gear/5-forward-looking-sonar-tested-29321

 

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - Tahiti, French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us

 


Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Justin,

No, I have not seen anything on their website, but had told them a year ago they could use any video they wanted from our YouTube channel.

Ken on Aquarius


Ken Powers SV Aquarius
 

Hello Ian,

It would be nice to know how the Echo Pilot died.  What happened, how it happened?   We hit a log off Columbia, and had to replace the transducer.  I really missed the EchoPilot when it was INOP, and was nice to get it operational again.   It's nice to get more information than... it died.   Also, you say you "Wanted to replace it".  So, I would think with this statement, you thought at the time having the FLS was in a word... "worthwhile".  Then you write.... "talked with all the major electronics manufacturers, none of whom seemed enthused by the technology."  What does this mean?  You talked with all the manufacturers of FLS units and none were enthused with their technology?  They all told you you should not replace your FLS because they are all junk?  

Seems very interesting that all the FLS manufacturers would say this!  Sorry for the sarcasm, just can't help myself. 

Ken


Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi Ken, what is the make and model of your fls. Does it have a stand alone display.

Thanks

Danny

SM 299

Ocean Pearl

On 29 September 2020 at 22:14 Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

Z and I have sailed a fairly good distance on Aquarius, and we touched the reef one time...  And that was when I didn't follow the guidance of my FLS.  All the maps said 2.5M, and we were at high tide..  Well, it was less than 2M, and I thought the FLS was wrong because it was saying 1.5M in front of me....  I was wrong, FLS was right, but luckily I only go .5KTS in those situations and was just a light bump and we backed out...  Now, I always listen to the FLS...  

There are Captains out there that will say, "I circled the globe without GPS, Who needs that"!   It's like some people want to prove they are better than others because they don't rely on such technology. "I just stick my wife up there, and she can spot everything". I don't use my FLS........  Great!

Last night I talked to another captain here in Thailand over a drink, and he was telling me the story about another captain he met that complained about other sailors that had to rely on their GPS... WHAT?  It's a device that when used properly, can make you safer captain. 


Here is my OPINION......  IF IT WILL MAKE YOU SAFER, AND IT's EASY TO USE, AND YOU WILL USE IT.  YOU SHOULD PROBABLY THINK ABOUT GETTING IT.   For that old sailor that thought GPS was useless, just think how safe he would be with a GPS, and the knowledge on how to use it properly...  All that old sailing knowledge, along with all the new tech, now that's what I would call... SAFE!  My friend said that he never again sailed with the old captain that didn't want to use a GPS.  

I have been saved twice by my forward looking sonar (FLS) "Echo Pilot".  I have several videos that show how I use the Echo Pilot when I am in shallow water, or potentially shallow water on our channel.  The Echo Pilotl helps me understand the shape of the bottom at and anchorage, or when I am trying to work my way in a narrow shallow channel.  Now, Yes, you can stick someone up on the bow....  That might be good idea in some cases.... BUT, in the Tuamotu Archipelago you might think twice about leaving you wife up on the bow for 5 hours as you make your way across one of the Atolls.   And, is she going to be sharp the entire time?  One of our friends hit the reef in the Tuamotu's, and they thought they were being safe.  Someone on lookout on the bow, but just a few second not watching after 4 hours of not seeing a thing, and WHAM they hit the reef.  Had to patch the hole, and head to Tahiti to get hauled out and repaired.  A nice $10K and 3 months later, everything good.  I was crossing one of the Atols, and my Alarm went off, I could see the reef in front of me on the FLS, and immediately applied full reverse, and we came within 10Ms of the reef.... Since I can only see what is directly in front of me, I don't try to turn, I just back out.   Aquarius would have hit that day.  I would like to add.....Sometimes the glare on the water makes it difficult to see the reef, but not for the FLS.  And.....Sometimes the clouds make it difficult to see the reef systems.  And, if the water is really clear... EVERYTHING LOOKS LIKE IT's 2M deep, then what do you do?  So, I guess you can stick someone up on the bow, and do you feel lucky.  Because they might not see it...   Fact is, you have the best chance of seeing the reef with someone up on the bow, and and FLS.   But, the person on the bow will get fatigued over time, and this will reduce the effectiveness of the watch.   $1500...  That's my 2cents....

I still think if you're going to cross oceans and sail new places...  Get an FLS that is easy to use, and you get good information...  I have one, and have been very happy with it.  Quite disappointed when we hit a log off Columbia and cracked my transducer.  It was down for several months....

Downsides to FLS.. Sometimes they will not work if there is heavy sediment in the water sometimes I was not able to get the depth for unto 5 minutes or so..  You can also get weird readings in fast currents with sediment in the water, or when looking into Prop Wash from a large vessel or tugboat.  But, you will get used to reading the prop wash with experience.

Ken Powers
Aquarius 
Super Maramu 262


Patrick McAneny
 

I have not read the bad press about the B&G FLS ,but I am less than impressed . I had it installed a few years ago when I replaced all my electronic on board . It sends out false signals showing obstruction and then disappears . No rep could explain or solve the issue. It may be that on  the Bay we have a mud bottom ??? I should have tried to use it in the Caribbean or New England ,but forgot to and never felt I need it. Maybe next time I have a hard bottom I will try to use it and see if it works better. But right now I wish I had spent the money on a lead line.
Does forward speed of the boat play a role in accuracy ? Maybe its me ,because this boat came with a new Interphase in the box , I installed it and was very disappointed in that as well. Going back to having my wife swim in front of the boat.
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Sep 27, 2020 11:32 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Forward looking Sonar - Amel 54 - Furuno NavNet Plotter Network

Hi Stefan,

Actually the B&G version got some pretty bad press. I have no first hand experience so I cannot confirm.
If your plotter supports video-in you could consider this one: https://echopilot.com/products/fls-platinum-engine/

This company has been working on this stuff for quite some time and what I've seen they get pretty decent reviews.

Kind regards,

Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Ian Townsend
 

Hi Ken. The FLS was on the boat when we bought it. We thought it was pretty cool and we could use it in areas where we were uncertain and therefore give us more confidence in exploring or anchoring areas with changing depth contours. We had never had one before. To a certain extent, although minimally, this was true. We relied on it maybe two or three times. And we did notice the occasional false reading which gave our hearts a jump every so often. 

Our EchoPilot unit was 20 years old. The display died and to replace it would have meant switching out everything including transducer, wiring and control head. We talked with all the major guys at the Fort Lauderdale show in 2018. The issues they had, even with their own technology, were twofold. First, rated forward distance capability is not that far (it varies by manufacturer but not by much) and whether you could actually react in time. Second, consistent accuracy. 

As with everything, one must weigh the cost vs. benefit. For us, we have been happy to put our money into other things, including new electronics. 

Ian & Margaret
Loca Lola II
SM153

On Sep 29, 2020, at 2:14 PM, Ken Powers SV Aquarius <ken@...> wrote:

Hello Ian,

It would be nice to know how the Echo Pilot died.  What happened, how it happened?   We hit a log off Columbia, and had to replace the transducer.  I really missed the EchoPilot when it was INOP, and was nice to get it operational again.   It's nice to get more information than... it died.   Also, you say you "Wanted to replace it".  So, I would think with this statement, you thought at the time having the FLS was in a word... "worthwhile".  Then you write.... "talked with all the major electronics manufacturers, none of whom seemed enthused by the technology."  What does this mean?  You talked with all the manufacturers of FLS units and none were enthused with their technology?  They all told you you should not replace your FLS because they are all junk?  

Seems very interesting that all the FLS manufacturers would say this!  Sorry for the sarcasm, just can't help myself. 

Ken