Wide open throttle


Richard Dallett
 

I ordered a 0311-201-001 dipstick and was invoiced for that number, and the bag stated that number, but the actual dipstick is a 3311-301-003.  I was assured that they are the same,  In any case, the 3311-301-003 is 6 1/8" over all and a full inch shorter than the one that has been in the gearbox, so I assume this gearbox has been running below the appropriate low level indicator for a long time.  No harm can be observed at the moment.

Richard
Mamba
A54 68


Dean Gillies
 

Hi Richard,
As I recall, when I talked about the distance from the fluid to the mating surface, I was referring to the mating surface of the gearbox rather than the dipstick. Also, don't forget that the dipstick is designed to measure whilst not screwed home. 

Do those clarifications make any difference to your thinking? If not, I'll go back and review my docs in more detail.
Best regards
Dean
SV Stella
A54-154


Richard Dallett
 

Hi, Dean,
I am also a bit confused. My A54 is number 68 from 2007 with a ZF25-2.0 gearbox, serial number 156 44 8.  I believe the dipstick when I bought the boat 2 months ago is too long, measuring 128 and 140 mm from mating surface to high and low marks.  I bought a 3311-301-003 from the Ft. Lauderdale dealer, but it measures 102 and 114 from the mating surface to the high and low marks, which is longer than you stated. I don't know if I should just put in 3 litres and mark that on the dipstick as a reference point. Any suggestions? I emailed ZF, but have not had a reply.

Richard
SV Mamba
A54-68


Porter McRoberts
 

Congratulations Susan and David:

We (Helen) and I own A54-152, your brother!
We have a new (relatively) “H” model D3-110 since 2019.  Wonderful engine.  
We get 2700 at WOT, clean hull and Brunton autoprop.  Bill R is correct, even a single barnacle spoils the party.
We rarely run WOT as when posed (your and my conventional wisdom)  to the North American lead engineer for Volvo, who helped install our new D3 then replied, “No not at all, the computer should perfectly calibrate the fuel/air mixture, regardless of throttle position.”  I found that quite interesting, and wasn’t convinced at the time.  

A symptom of fuel:O2 mismatch (in my thinking) is carbon, in the turbo, and on the side of the hull, aft of the exhaust port.
We indeed had that, common Amel finding, before the D3-110 “C” engine change.  
We’re now 1200 hrs into the new engine.  No soot on the hull, not even a slight amount.  And when I took off and inspected the turbo and exhaust elbow recently, the thinnest of dust layers.  And interestingly, oil color at 200hrs: dark honey.
Our typical rpm is 900-1200.  Occasionally above, but less than 1% of the time. And we rarely do the burn out/ tune up.
Temp always between 79-81d C.

I offer the above to our collective for the following reasons:

I was quite down on Volvo for a variety of reasons, but principally I thought we (it's a family disease) got a bad D3 engine, death pronounced around 1100 hrs, despite significant recussitory effort, and sadly no DNR in place.
Volvo paid for our new one, I would have preferred a Beta, still think them excellent (especially during electrical storms), but have been very happy with the D3-110 “H” I think they may have actually NOW “marinized” the D3-110, in this “H” configuration.

There is a definite improvement in combustion cleanliness, efficiency, and sound: in that order.

We still “only” get 2700 rpm.  Not the advertised 3000.

Congratulations on your Dragonfly, an amazing boat. It makes me smile, envisioning your future!

Porter and Helen McRoberts
A54-152 S/V IBIS
Brisbane


On Jan 15, 2022, at 10:30 PM, David Odell <david.wanderer@...> wrote:

This is my first post as my wife Susan and I just bought A54 #153, originally named Aora, now Dragonfly. Excited to be a part of this community, and what great boats these Amels!
 
My question pertains to running the Volvo Penta at wide open throttle. I previously had a trawler with a 170 hp Lugger diesel. The Lugger technical support manager advised the fleet to run the engine at wide open throttle after 6-8 hours of engine usage. We would run wide open throttle for 5-10 minutes to burn off all of the carbon build up and to heat up the gaskets and seals. Engine temperature would go from 180 degrees F to about 195 degrees F. We would never let the engine temperature exceed 205 degrees F. 
 
A few questions:
 
1.  Do you run your Volvo Penta at wide open throttle and for how long?
 
2. What is your normal engine running temperature, and what does the temperature reach at wide open throttle?
 
3. Under normal engine operating conditions, is there an RPM “sweet spot” where the engine is happy and the fuel burn is efficient?
 
Thanks in advance. 

David
 
David Odell
A54 #153 Dragonfly
Southport, North Carolina
Currently lying Le Marin, Martinique


Dean Gillies
 

Hi David,
Welcome to the Amel family. I own Amel 54 Hull No 154 so we may have a lot in common as our boats are almost twins.
I don't choose to operate at WOT, but on testing (with a clean H6 Autoprop) I found around 2900rpm to be possible.
My running temperatures lie between 78/79C and 82/83C when operating at low revs (say 1200), and high revs (2200-2400).
I actually have some very detailed logs of sea trials with all this data, when trying to diagnose a failed gearbox, but its all on the boat (and I wont be there until April).    
I tend to motor around 1400rm in flat water/no wind and generally don't exceed 2000rpm when motoring into waves and wind.
Every now and again (maybe 20-30 hours) I will run for 5-10 minutes at 2200-2400 to get the temperature up to max. (I haven't noticed it go above 83, regardless of how high you rev above 2400)
 
David, my ZF25 gearbox failed around 800 hours due to a long-term lack of transmission fluid in the hydraulic gearbox. My boat was supplied with the WRONG dipstick, it was too long.
Its a complex scenario because the ZF25 maintenance instructions claim the capacity is 2 litres and instructs to fill with 2 litres of ATF and then top up to the dipstick line.  If you have the correct dipstick then you will need to add another full litre of ATF because in reality this is a 3 litre gearbox.  Please refer to my post  for more details.
The important thing is that you should check the length of your dipstick to make sure you don't have this latent problem, particularly as your hull No is so close to mine. I believe the thread above contains the part number of the dipstick you need (Its stamped on the stick)

Fair winds.
Dean
SV Stella
A54-154


 

David,

The number one reason some Amel owners do not achieve RPM at WOT is the AutoProp is fouled. If only one barnacle finds just the right spot on only one blade, the blade will pitch too deep and higher RPM will not be achieved. The AutoProp is great, but it comes with responsibilities. 😀


CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
   

On Sun, Jan 16, 2022 at 8:48 AM David Odell <david.wanderer@...> wrote:
Thanks Mohammad and Nick, very helpful information. Much appreciated. David 


David Odell
 

Thanks Mohammad and Nick, very helpful information. Much appreciated. David 


Nick Newington
 

Hi David,
Welcome.
I run my engine at near max rpm every 25 hours or so for 5 minutes. 
On my 54, with Volvo Penta D3 110 and Bruntons Autoprop; WOT is about 2700 rpm. 
Normal engine running temperature is 78 degrees C at 1200 rpm but at WOT it goes up to about 83. According to the instrument panel!
As for normal running I tend to be very economic and run it between 1200 and 1500 rpm unless I am in a hurry. Occasionally there is a need to punch into a strong headwind, in which case maybe 2000 rpm. 
I think that the beauty of the Autoprop is that it loads up the engine very nicely in low rpm, which is extremely fuel efficient and quiet in flat water or motorsailing.

Nick
S/Y Amelia 
AML54-019
Leros Gr



On 15 Jan 2022, at 12:30, David Odell <david.wanderer@...> wrote:

This is my first post as my wife Susan and I just bought A54 #153, originally named Aora, now Dragonfly. Excited to be a part of this community, and what great boats these Amels!
 
My question pertains to running the Volvo Penta at wide open throttle. I previously had a trawler with a 170 hp Lugger diesel. The Lugger technical support manager advised the fleet to run the engine at wide open throttle after 6-8 hours of engine usage. We would run wide open throttle for 5-10 minutes to burn off all of the carbon build up and to heat up the gaskets and seals. Engine temperature would go from 180 degrees F to about 195 degrees F. We would never let the engine temperature exceed 205 degrees F. 
 
A few questions:
 
1.  Do you run your Volvo Penta at wide open throttle and for how long?
 
2. What is your normal engine running temperature, and what does the temperature reach at wide open throttle?
 
3. Under normal engine operating conditions, is there an RPM “sweet spot” where the engine is happy and the fuel burn is efficient?
 
Thanks in advance. 

David
 
David Odell
A54 #153 Dragonfly
Southport, North Carolina
Currently lying Le Marin, Martinique


Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hello David and welcome to the Amel Family;

 

  1. The advice of most knowledgeable Volvo mechanics that we have run into, has been to run the engine at 2000-2200 RPMs (about 80% max) for 1-2 minutes at the end of every day of motoring. We used to run at max RPM for 2 minutes every 2 weeks, but did end up with some carbon buildup ( we think) that led to the actuator arm on the turbo variable geometry getting sticky. We have been doing the daily rev up for one season and seem to have had good results.
  2. Normal engine temp is 80 Celsius, which is what the thermostat is set at. At wide open throttle (held for up to 2 minutes) , we have never seen more than 1 degree temperature rise to 81 C.
  3. Our cruising RPM is 1350 with the Brunton’s H6 prop which gets up to about 6.6 knots in calm conditions and clean bottom and prop, the cockpit noise is extremely low and comfortable and we average about 3.7 l/hour.  

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Odell via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2022 4:30 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Wide open throttle

 

This is my first post as my wife Susan and I just bought A54 #153, originally named Aora, now Dragonfly. Excited to be a part of this community, and what great boats these Amels!

 

My question pertains to running the Volvo Penta at wide open throttle. I previously had a trawler with a 170 hp Lugger diesel. The Lugger technical support manager advised the fleet to run the engine at wide open throttle after 6-8 hours of engine usage. We would run wide open throttle for 5-10 minutes to burn off all of the carbon build up and to heat up the gaskets and seals. Engine temperature would go from 180 degrees F to about 195 degrees F. We would never let the engine temperature exceed 205 degrees F. 

 

A few questions:

 

1.  Do you run your Volvo Penta at wide open throttle and for how long?

 

2. What is your normal engine running temperature, and what does the temperature reach at wide open throttle?

 

3. Under normal engine operating conditions, is there an RPM “sweet spot” where the engine is happy and the fuel burn is efficient?

 

Thanks in advance. 

David

 

David Odell

A54 #153 Dragonfly

Southport, North Carolina

Currently lying Le Marin, Martinique


David Odell
 

This is my first post as my wife Susan and I just bought A54 #153, originally named Aora, now Dragonfly. Excited to be a part of this community, and what great boats these Amels!
 
My question pertains to running the Volvo Penta at wide open throttle. I previously had a trawler with a 170 hp Lugger diesel. The Lugger technical support manager advised the fleet to run the engine at wide open throttle after 6-8 hours of engine usage. We would run wide open throttle for 5-10 minutes to burn off all of the carbon build up and to heat up the gaskets and seals. Engine temperature would go from 180 degrees F to about 195 degrees F. We would never let the engine temperature exceed 205 degrees F. 
 
A few questions:
 
1.  Do you run your Volvo Penta at wide open throttle and for how long?
 
2. What is your normal engine running temperature, and what does the temperature reach at wide open throttle?
 
3. Under normal engine operating conditions, is there an RPM “sweet spot” where the engine is happy and the fuel burn is efficient?
 
Thanks in advance. 

David
 
David Odell
A54 #153 Dragonfly
Southport, North Carolina
Currently lying Le Marin, Martinique