Keel rust and grounding


Ben Levy
 

Hi everyone, 
Based on past posts, it looks like rust on the keel of an Amel is not something unheard of. My concern however is that, unlike what my surveyor told me, the grounding cable that is connected to the keel bolt in the bilge has obviously been long gone (I only found bits and pieces of a crumbling grounding cable). There is physically no way this can be replaced by a human without at least emptying the entire engine compartment.
As the corrosion on the keel is worrying me (more so that it is not connected to any anode), can I drill a hole in the keel to attach an anode? It might not solve entirely the rust issue but it would resolve the grounding one? Anyone has any thoughts or experience on this matter? 

Cheers. Ben
M #98 


Mark Erdos
 

 

 

The copper grounding to the keel bolt in the bilge is not very hard to replace. You will need a series of socket extension rods to reach the keel bolt. The specs for making a solid replacement can be found here on the forum. However, I would advise to using a woven copper strap if you can get the material. The woven material is more conductive.

 

With best regards,

 

Mark

 

Skipper

Sailing Vessel - Cream Puff - SM2K - #275

Currently cruising - French Polynesia

www.creampuff.us


On 6/27/2022 11:49 AM, Ben Levy wrote:

Hi everyone, 
Based on past posts, it looks like rust on the keel of an Amel is not something unheard of. My concern however is that, unlike what my surveyor told me, the grounding cable that is connected to the keel bolt in the bilge has obviously been long gone (I only found bits and pieces of a crumbling grounding cable). There is physically no way this can be replaced by a human without at least emptying the entire engine compartment.
As the corrosion on the keel is worrying me (more so that it is not connected to any anode), can I drill a hole in the keel to attach an anode? It might not solve entirely the rust issue but it would resolve the grounding one? Anyone has any thoughts or experience on this matter? 

Cheers. Ben
M #98 


Bill Kinney
 

Ben,  

There are two separate issues here.  First is the need to reconnect the keel to the bonding system.  That is an annoying job, but by no means beyond the reach of a normal human!  A half-inch ratchet and several LONG extension bars will let you back off the nut that held the original copper strap.  Amel used relatively thin copper foil for this, and it wasn't unusual for people to use a lot of chlorine bleach in various parts of the water system that corroded the copper parts away to nothing. You can replace with a copper bar, or a copper tube (easier to get) hammered flat.  The amount of current being carried here is TINY.  Any connection that holds together will work absolutely fine.  Copper braid would work, but is really only better for high frequency service (which this is NOT), and the higher surface area makes it much faster to corrode.

Issue #2.  If you have rust on the keel now, you need to fix that and isolate the cast iron from the ocean.  It is not a very hard fix, but it NEEDS to be done exactly right.  Really.  No shortcuts.  If you search the archives here, Joel Potter has posted a description of the best practice for this.  You can do it yourself, or pay someone else.  If you pay someone to do this be absolutely sure they do EXACTLY as Joel describes. ANY shortcuts will turn the entire project into wasted money.  

Bill Kinney
SM160, Harmonie
Port Louis, Grenada


Eric Freedman
 

Ben,

Replacing the grounding strap is very simple . There are no drastic measures needed.

Please review the archives . Once you make a new strap it is a 1-2 hour job.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Ben Levy
Sent: Monday, June 27, 2022 5:50 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Keel rust and grounding

 

Hi everyone, 
Based on past posts, it looks like rust on the keel of an Amel is not something unheard of. My concern however is that, unlike what my surveyor told me, the grounding cable that is connected to the keel bolt in the bilge has obviously been long gone (I only found bits and pieces of a crumbling grounding cable). There is physically no way this can be replaced by a human without at least emptying the entire engine compartment.
As the corrosion on the keel is worrying me (more so that it is not connected to any anode), can I drill a hole in the keel to attach an anode? It might not solve entirely the rust issue but it would resolve the grounding one? Anyone has any thoughts or experience on this matter? 

Cheers. Ben
M #98 


Ben Levy
 

Thank you for your inputs. I am a bit surprised however that all 3 of you said it was easy to access.. Could it be that on a SM the access to the bildge keel bolt is different and easier than on the original maramu? I have spent days trying to clean the bottom of my bilge and it is not easy at all to even touch the bottom with a 1m stick to pock the dirt off. Can anyone confirm having done it on a Maramu? 
Thanks for the tip about the keel rust, I'll look it up. 

Cheers 
Ben 


Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Hi Ben,

I used a pressure washer; an essential tool in my opinion.  

Jean-Pierre Germain, ex Eleuthera, SM007


On 30 Jun 2022, at 07:07, Ben Levy <benjamin.levy@...> wrote:

Thank you for your inputs. I am a bit surprised however that all 3 of you said it was easy to access.. Could it be that on a SM the access to the bildge keel bolt is different and easier than on the original maramu? I have spent days trying to clean the bottom of my bilge and it is not easy at all to even touch the bottom with a 1m stick to pock the dirt off. Can anyone confirm having done it on a Maramu? 
Thanks for the tip about the keel rust, I'll look it up. 

Cheers 
Ben 


 

It is relatively easy if you follow these instructions for a SM (Maramu will be a similar process). 

Obviously, if it has not been cleaned regularly it will be substantially more difficult.
image.png


CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
   

On Thu, Jun 30, 2022 at 7:15 AM Germain Jean-Pierre <jp.germain45@...> wrote:
Hi Ben,

I used a pressure washer; an essential tool in my opinion.  

Jean-Pierre Germain, ex Eleuthera, SM007


On 30 Jun 2022, at 07:07, Ben Levy <benjamin.levy@...> wrote:

Thank you for your inputs. I am a bit surprised however that all 3 of you said it was easy to access.. Could it be that on a SM the access to the bildge keel bolt is different and easier than on the original maramu? I have spent days trying to clean the bottom of my bilge and it is not easy at all to even touch the bottom with a 1m stick to pock the dirt off. Can anyone confirm having done it on a Maramu? 
Thanks for the tip about the keel rust, I'll look it up. 

Cheers 
Ben 


VICTOR MOLERO
 

Hi Ben. 
In my first attempt I reached your same conclusion: it is impossible. Then I found a way around and got it clean by using diapers and an extension gripper (you can buy it in a chinese bazaar). Then I had a bar built with a nut welded to the end the same size as the nut in the bottom of the bilge. It has worked fine every time that I have had to use it.
If you need further explanations, let me know. 
Victor 
Alendoy SM314


Christian Alby
 

good day to you, 
maramu owner
did & do the cleaning once a year; set of scraper & brush on long wooden handle - I remove all suction hoses & replace.
I also have the M32 socket welded on a steel tube to check or remove the keel bolt & replace the ground braided strap.
works fine once decision is taken to tackle the job. (hardest part).
but worth it once it is done
cheers

Le jeudi 30 juin 2022 à 16:39:01 UTC+2, VICTOR MOLERO <victor.moleroxx@...> a écrit :


Hi Ben. 
In my first attempt I reached your same conclusion: it is impossible. Then I found a way around and got it clean by using diapers and an extension gripper (you can buy it in a chinese bazaar). Then I had a bar built with a nut welded to the end the same size as the nut in the bottom of the bilge. It has worked fine every time that I have had to use it.
If you need further explanations, let me know. 
Victor 
Alendoy SM314


Charlie Kopp
 

Hi Ben-

I’m currently dealing with this exact problem. My Super Maramu is in a boatyard having the rust removed from the keel, but my bonding system is non-existent. I purchased a copper bar exactly like the one pictured in the photos section of this group. It is 1/8” x 2” x 48”. It was about $75 from Online Metals. As I live in Seattle, I didn’t have to pay shipping (you’ll find shipping is quite expensive on odd-shaped metal items).

i plan to shape it just like the picture (go to photo section and search for “bonding”). That post is for a Maramu so I’m hoping it will work for a Super Maramu as well.

It’s difficult and unpleasant dealing with cleaning and emptying your sump, but it’s quite possible. First time I cleaned mine I found dozens of treasures down there. I may post a picture later. It’s quite amazing how much stuff had been lost to the sump by previous owners.

you may want to get one of those grabbers where there is a small claw at the end of a long flexible shaft. That helped me immensely in retrieving items from way down there. 

I’ll share anything I learn when working on this. I’m struggling to understand exactly what needs to be connected. I know it needs to go to the rudder shaft. The rudder is hollow (and fills with water intentionally) and your anodes (zincs) connect to the stainless steel skeleton of the rudder. Apparently all underwater metal needs to get connected together, including your keel ballast (made of iron), and needs to connect to the anodes on your rudder. Those are the only anodes you need if the bonding system is intact. Apparently you don’t even need a zinc on your prop, although you’ll probably have one if it’s a MaxProp.

Good luck. Let us know how it goes.

-Charlie Kopp
-Cloud Seven (SM#50)


Ian Park
 

Charlie
The copper strap you are fitting to the keel bolt. You may find a green and yellow wire attached to the engine/C drive which is currently doing nothing. This should be attached to the top end of the copper strap. If it is missing put a new wire there. This connects the engine C drive to the anodes on the rudder. You’ll see the same yellow green wire on your toilet valve through hulls etc and from your rudder quarantine. There is a network of these wires leading back to the rudder.
I haven’t seen a bonding layout, but I know where all these wires are that are part of that on my Santorin.

Have fun with the bilge!

Ian


 

From my Amel Book (Amel Book online subscription is as low as $100/year): 

I have a page for the 54 which is similar. The SN, 55, and probably Maramu are also similar.

Bill


CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
   


On Fri, Jul 1, 2022 at 9:11 AM Ian Park <parkianj@...> wrote:
Charlie
The copper strap you are fitting to the keel bolt. You may find a green and yellow wire attached to the engine/C drive which is currently doing nothing. This should be attached to the top end of the copper strap. If it is missing put a new wire there. This connects the engine C drive to the anodes on the rudder. You’ll see the same yellow green wire on your toilet valve through hulls etc and from your rudder quarantine. There is a network of these wires leading back to the rudder.
I haven’t seen a bonding layout, but I know where all these wires are that are part of that on my Santorin.

Have fun with the bilge!

Ian






Charlie Kopp
 

Thank you, Ian.

I’ve looked for, but haven’t found these wires yet. Will look again this weekend…