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[Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem

Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

The Amel Bow Thruster shaft tube removal tool is placed around the black shaft tube  just under the motor (engine). It is clamped securely to the shaft tube. Then you turn the bolts which will press against the motor (engine). This will cause the motor (engine) and the shaft tube to separate.

Be prepared for the separation or the bow thruster will fall to the ground.

This rust which is holding the black shaft tube to the electric motor is caused by saltwater leaking past the seals and possibly by leaving the bow thruster down in rough water. Other causes are an overloaded boat with too much weight in the bow. Also forgetting to use the safety pin when the bow thruster is raised.

Be sure to clean the bottom of the motor where the shaft tube meets and visually inspect the bearing on the shaft of the motor. That bearing may need replacing. If it does, be sure to hire a highly qualified electric motor repairman. That motor is no longer available and you do not want to damage it or ruin it. When reassembling use plenty of waterproof grease at the junction of the shaft tube and the motor. I recommend service during every haulout...about every 2 years.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 13, 2016 2:45 AM, "rossienio@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Good morning, I did what told me Craig (chain wrench used with extension, taping with hammer), but the thruster black shaft does NOT want to move. I think I'll try the Amel tool. Could someone explain to me where you place the tool and how to use it? It should be put around the shaft and pushed down by turning the screws which press under  of the engine? Thanks to anyone who can help me. 
enio rossi
 

Thank you once again. Beat with a hammer on the shaft tube, while the tool is pulling,can help the detachment of the rust, or risk of damage the same tube? I'm working but does not seems to go down..........
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Roasienio,

You already have obtained the tool?

Are you using the tool?

I have used a hammer, but this can be dangerous. Care is needed. If you break the cast iron housing, you will not be able to replace it.

See if you can find an electric rotary hammer impact device which could be set to vibrate the housing of the electric motor (engine), while the tool pulls downward on the black shaft tube.
Something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BB79Q6/ref=s9_top_hd_bw_b2Jp4_g469_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-2&pf_rd_r=BJDXNMBHYYM7SNE5CMSQ&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=2188956302&pf_rd_i=552858

Continue to spray penetrating fluid in and around the joint that is stuck. I would use rotary hammer vibration for an hour. If that doesn't work let the penetrating fluid soak for a day then one more hour. If you haven't used one of these devices  before I suggest that you get expert help. Do not let anyone use a torch.

You understand that all of your problem was caused by lack of service.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 14, 2016 10:04 AM, "rossienio@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Thank you once again. Beat with a hammer on the shaft tube, while the tool is pulling,can help the detachment of the rust, or risk of damage the same tube? I'm working but does not seems to go down..........
Craig Briggs
 

Enio,
No, don't hammer on the tube - only on the metal of the electric motor. You might try tightening your extraction tool AND using the chain wrench around the electric motor base. Keep at it for a few hours each day and it will eventually loosen up (I think :-)
Craig Briggs, SN#68 Sangaris
enio rossi
 

A mechanical blacksmith, who also makes car engines adjustement,built me something like the Amel tool..........I'm trying with the tool, and also with the chain wrench and WD40.
Thursday will be an engeneer working on the boats(???!!!) .
Let's hope so. Thanks again.
enio rossi
 

Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and the help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil (SAE90????) and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3 foam seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV France? 
Germain Jean-Pierre <jgermain@...>
 

Greetings,

Amel has an email dedicated to parts ordering…

SAV at amel.com     You can also consult their web site for added info.

GL

Jean-Pierre Germain
SY Eleuthera, SM 007



On 20 Jun 2016, at 10:15, rossienio@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and the help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil (SAE90????) and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3 foam seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV France? 


Jean-Pierre Germain,
SY Eleuthera, Amel Super Maramu 007
Porto Turistico Marina di Ragusa, Pontoon M15,
97100 Ragusa, Sicily, Italy
+44 7551 211 511
jp.germain@...
christian alby <calbyy@...>
 

send to
sav@... 
they will send  the drawing with parts list & respond on availability of parts
rgds
christian alby, Desirade VIII, Maramu nr 116

Christian Alby - France home fixe +33 (0)5 34 39 06 02 home Internet +33 (0)9 60 37 22 72 mobile +33 (0)6 42 69 07 80


De : "rossienio@... [amelyachtowners]"
À : amelyachtowners@...
Envoyé le : Lundi 20 juin 2016 10h15
Objet : Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem

 
Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and the help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil (SAE90????) and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3 foam seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV France? 
Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Glad you got it out.

Yes the oil is SAE 90
The email is: sav@amel.fr

If I may suggest, purchase spare foam seals, seals, nylon bolt, hubs,, stainless pin, etc.
Heroes what I carry on:
http://nikimat.com/spare_parts_bow_thruster.html

Here are pictures I took of the overhaul procedure written by Gary Silver and notes from Bill Rouse.
http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html

If you need help don’t hesitate.

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico




--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 6/20/16, rossienio@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, June 20, 2016, 3:15 AM


 









Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is
out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and the
help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil (SAE90????)
and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3 foam
seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV
France? 









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Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Alex,

Everyone should download the fantastic photo display of the bow thruster overhaul that you provide at http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html It is the best! Perfect!

Also, regarding your parts list. Amel has changed the foam seals to all 3 seals being Neoprene foam seal 110x60. The Natural Foam that was used inside is now Neoprene foam. You may want to update your parts list to reflect this change.

Thanks,

Bill
BeBe 387



On Mon, Jun 20, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Glad you got it out.

Yes the oil is SAE 90
The email is: sav@...

If I may suggest, purchase spare foam seals, seals, nylon bolt, hubs,, stainless pin, etc.
Heroes what I carry on:
http://nikimat.com/spare_parts_bow_thruster.html

Here are pictures I took of the overhaul procedure written by Gary Silver and notes from Bill Rouse.
http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html

If you need help don’t hesitate.

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico

--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 6/20/16, rossienio@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Monday, June 20, 2016, 3:15 AM


 









Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is
out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and the
help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil (SAE90????)
and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3 foam
seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV
France? 









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Bill <greatketch@...>
 

And the size of the seal on the prop shaft has changed too...

from an ID of 30 to 29.



On Jun 20, 2016, at 09:07, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

 

Alex,

Everyone should download the fantastic photo display of the bow thruster overhaul that you provide at http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html It is the best! Perfect!

Also, regarding your parts list. Amel has changed the foam seals to all 3 seals being Neoprene foam seal 110x60. The Natural Foam that was used inside is now Neoprene foam. You may want to update your parts list to reflect this change.

Thanks,

Bill
BeBe 387



On Mon, Jun 20, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Glad you got it out.

Yes the oil is SAE 90
The email is: sav@...

If I may suggest, purchase spare foam seals, seals, nylon bolt, hubs,, stainless pin, etc.
Heroes what I carry on:
http://nikimat.com/spare_parts_bow_thruster.html

Here are pictures I took of the overhaul procedure written by Gary Silver and notes from Bill Rouse.
http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html

If you need help don’t hesitate.

Sincerely, Alexandre
SM2K #289 NIKIMAT
Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico

--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 6/20/16, rossienio@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: amelyachtowners@...
Date: Monday, June 20, 2016, 3:15 AM


 









Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is
out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and the
help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil (SAE90????)
and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3 foam
seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV
France? 









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#yiv1941608189


Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Bill,

Without Gary Silver and your help, I could not have done it. So first a big thank to both of you!

I will need to improve it, as I did not show the replacement of the 2 foam seals on the bow thruster foot.
Also I should cut it in sections, to make it more low bandwidth friendly…

Also, the last time, it was much easier to add the bearings.

I just added the new specifications on the neoprene foam seal and the seal.

Sincerely, Alexandre



--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 6/20/16, 'Bill & Judy Rouse' yahoogroups@svbebe.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: "amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com" <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Monday, June 20, 2016, 8:07 AM


 









Alex,
Everyone should download the
fantastic photo display of the bow thruster overhaul that
you provide at http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html It
is the best! Perfect!
Also,
regarding your parts list. Amel has changed the foam seals
to all 3 seals being Neoprene foam seal 110x60. The Natural
Foam that was used inside is now Neoprene foam. You may want
to update your parts list to reflect this
change.
Thanks,
BillBeBe
387


On Mon, Jun 20, 2016 at
11:48 AM, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@rocketmail.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:















 









Glad you got it out.



Yes the oil is SAE 90

The email is: sav@amel.fr



If I may suggest, purchase spare foam seals, seals, nylon
bolt, hubs,, stainless pin, etc.

Heroes what I carry on:

http://nikimat.com/spare_parts_bow_thruster.html



Here are pictures I took of the overhaul procedure written
by Gary Silver and notes from Bill Rouse.

http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html



If you need help don’t hesitate.



Sincerely, Alexandre

SM2K #289 NIKIMAT

Club Nautico de San Juan, Puerto Rico



--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 6/20/16, rossienio@yahoo.com
[amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com>
wrote:



Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service.
Problem

To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com

Date: Monday, June 20, 2016, 3:15 AM





 



















Thanks for your suggestions. Finally the foot is

out!!!!!!I used a chain wrench, a hammer, Amel tool and
the

help of a mechanic. Now I have to change the oil
(SAE90????)

and 3 new neoprene washers. Who should I order the 3
foam

seals? Does anyone have the email address  of Amel AV

France? 



















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enio rossi
 

Thanks again friends!! I ordered new foam seals. But now, given what read here,I have to put two or three foam seals on bow thruster shaft of my Santorin?  
Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

I don't own a Santorin, I own a Super Maramu, I assume they are similar.
Consequently I strongly suggest 2 on the foot as Amel originally designed it.
And 1 inside.
if you have not seen it yet, here illustration of Gary & Bill instruction:
http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html

Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------

On Tue, 6/21/16, rossienio@yahoo.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, June 21, 2016, 8:43 AM


 









Thanks again friends!! I ordered new foam seals.
But now, given what read here,I have to put two or three
foam seals on bow thruster shaft of my Santorin?  









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Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Yes,

2 outside, 1 inside.

Bill
BeBe 387

On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 1:48 PM, Alexandre Uster von Baar uster@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

I don't own a Santorin, I own a Super Maramu, I assume they are similar.
Consequently I strongly suggest 2 on the foot as Amel originally designed it.
And 1 inside.
if you have not seen it yet, here illustration of Gary & Bill instruction:
http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html

Sincerely, Alexandre

--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 6/21/16, rossienio@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: amelyachtowners@...
 Date: Tuesday, June 21, 2016, 8:43 AM


 









Thanks again friends!! I ordered new foam seals.
But now, given what read here,I have to put two or three
foam seals on bow thruster shaft of my Santorin?  









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enio rossi
 

The shaft of the Santorin BT has a diameter of 59-60mm, as I believe that of the SM, then the foam seals are the same?  Then why it says here (3D Bow thruster) that it should be put on the SM 3 outside? Excuse me, but I want to avoid any leakage of water, and I am not at all experienced. regards. enio 
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

The foam seals on the SM are placed 2 outside and one inside. The outside foam helps seal water when the bow thruster is retracted. The inside seal helps seal water when the bow thruster us in use. The primary seal is the lip seal on the tube.

Bill Rouse
BeBe Amel 53 #387
Sent from my tablet
+1832-380-4970 USA Voice Mail

On Jun 22, 2016 4:09 PM, "rossienio@... [amelyachtowners]" <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

The shaft of the Santorin BT has a diameter of 59-60mm, as I believe that of the SM, then the foam seals are the same?  Then why it says here (3D Bow thruster) that it should be put on the SM 3 outside? Excuse me, but I want to avoid any leakage of water, and I am not at all experienced. regards. enio 
Jim Anderson
 

Perfect timing on this topic for me. Thanks in advance for any help with the following questions. Please forgive me for demonstrating ineptitude as I chime in with a few questions:

 

1. When doing the in-the-water service today on SM384, as per Gary Silver’s instructions & Bill Rouse’s additional notes, after removing the four hex-head screws that secure the Thruster Shaft Housing to the Motor, the shaft would not drop all the way down and out the bottom of the boat. It stopped a good 2” above the “stopper” hose clamp. After installing the Amel Special Tool initially I could lift the shaft up and down but after trying to ram it downwards it stuck and wouldn’t budge up or down. I had to hire a diver. After much pulling and wiggling the diver finally got the shaft to come out. Upon inspection of the foot, shaft and the diver’s inspection of the Thruster Trunk nothing looked unusual. Any ideas what might have caused this?

I am hoping I won’t encounter the same problem with the shaft getting stuck when trying to put it back in tomorrow.

 

2. The diameter of the two neoprene seals on the Thruster Foot is larger than the width of the foot on one side and would over-hang on one side, except the excess was trimmed off with a razor knife. (Photo posted at: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1196149903

The Amel-supplied replacements are identical and will need have the over-hang trimmed off too if they are not to over-hang.  Is this normal? (Last service, seals in photo done by Amel Martinique.)

 

3. Where is the Prop Shaft Lip Seal? Is it in the hub of the propeller, flush with the 6 nylon screws that hold the prop on, or is it behind the prop in the foot? I removed the 6 nylon screws from the prop but it will not come off.  The seal in the hub of the prop, flush with the nylon screws, is smaller than the Amel-supplied prop shaft seal so I presume the lip seal is in the trunk behind the prop. If so, any suggestions on how to get the prop off with the 6 nylon screws removed?


Again, thanks for any help and please forgive me for demonstrating my ignorance.


Jim

SM384 Sirena Azul

Seattle
Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

Good morning Jim,

1) I did 3 times the bow thruster overall and it never happened to me, unless I am not understanding the question…
You did not keep the stopper to make the Thruster shaft going through the seal did you?

Here are pictures I took, it if helps: http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html


2) Being cut is normal, I think a slightly better job could have been done cutting the foam.

3) The prop shaft lip seal in under the propeller hub, here is the picture:
http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul/bow_thruster_overhaul_22.jpg

You will need to be “VERY” careful using 3 tiny screw to pull it out. You don’t want to damage the food of the bow thruster.
Look at my pictures. I think it will make sense.

Sincerely, Alexandre





--------------------------------------------

On Wed, 6/22/16, capt.anderson@gmail.com [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Re: bow thruster service. Problem
To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2016, 11:11 PM


 











Perfect timing on
this topic for me. Thanks in advance
for any help with the following questions. Please forgive me
for demonstrating
ineptitude as I chime in with a few questions:

 

1. When doing the
in-the-water service today on SM384, as
per Gary Silver’s instructions & Bill Rouse’s
additional notes, after
removing the four hex-head screws that secure the Thruster
Shaft Housing to the
Motor, the shaft would not drop all the way down and out the
bottom of the boat.
It stopped a good 2” above the “stopper” hose clamp.
After installing the Amel
Special Tool initially I could lift the shaft up and down
but after trying to
ram it downwards it stuck and wouldn’t budge up or down. I
had to hire a diver.
After much pulling and wiggling the diver finally got the
shaft to come out.
Upon inspection of the foot, shaft and the diver’s
inspection of the Thruster
Trunk nothing looked unusual. Any ideas what might have
caused this?

I am hoping I won’t
encounter the same problem with the
shaft getting stuck when trying to put it back in
tomorrow.

 

2. The diameter of the
two neoprene seals on the Thruster
Foot is larger than the width of the foot on one side and
would over-hang on
one side, except the excess was trimmed off with a razor
knife. (Photo posted
at: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1196149903

The Amel-supplied
replacements are identical and will
need have the over-hang trimmed off too if they are not to
over-hang.  Is this normal? (Last service,
seals in photo
done by Amel Martinique.)

 

3. Where is the Prop
Shaft Lip Seal? Is it in the hub of
the propeller, flush with the 6 nylon screws that hold the
prop on, or is it
behind the prop in the foot? I removed the 6 nylon screws
from the prop but it
will not come off.  The seal in the hub
of the prop, flush with the nylon screws, is smaller than
the Amel-supplied prop shaft seal so I presume the
lip seal is in the trunk behind the prop. If so, any
suggestions on how to get
the prop off with the 6 nylon screws removed?
Again, thanks for any help
and please forgive me for demonstrating my ignorance.
JimSM384 Sirena AzulSeattle










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#yiv3352698027
Bill & Judy Rouse <yahoogroups@...>
 

Jim,

You did not say that you looked up at the bottom of the motor.  It probably looks like this: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1587075684/lightbox/549533960?orderBy=ordinal&sortOrder=asc&photoFilter=ALL#zax/549533960

As the cast iron electric motor housing oxidizes because of salt water, the rust causes a reduction in size of the tube connection, freezing the tube to the motor housing. Take a camera and point it up at the bottom of the motor and see if you get something similar to the above.

Clean the oxidation very well and use wet dry sand paper on the inside wall. Then grease this entire area with waterproof grease...also same grease for the end of the tube that inserts into the motor housing.

Take a look at Alex's photos on a rebuild of the bow thruster at http://nikimat.com/bow_thruster_overhaul.html
You will see that the bow thruster propeller shaft is behind the white Delrin propeller hub.

You need to slightly trim the external (2) neoprene seals to fit.

Hope this helps.

Bill
BeBe 387
Currently Grenada



On Thu, Jun 23, 2016 at 4:11 AM, capt.anderson@... [amelyachtowners] <amelyachtowners@...> wrote:
 

Perfect timing on this topic for me. Thanks in advance for any help with the following questions. Please forgive me for demonstrating ineptitude as I chime in with a few questions:

 

1. When doing the in-the-water service today on SM384, as per Gary Silver’s instructions & Bill Rouse’s additional notes, after removing the four hex-head screws that secure the Thruster Shaft Housing to the Motor, the shaft would not drop all the way down and out the bottom of the boat. It stopped a good 2” above the “stopper” hose clamp. After installing the Amel Special Tool initially I could lift the shaft up and down but after trying to ram it downwards it stuck and wouldn’t budge up or down. I had to hire a diver. After much pulling and wiggling the diver finally got the shaft to come out. Upon inspection of the foot, shaft and the diver’s inspection of the Thruster Trunk nothing looked unusual. Any ideas what might have caused this?

I am hoping I won’t encounter the same problem with the shaft getting stuck when trying to put it back in tomorrow.

 

2. The diameter of the two neoprene seals on the Thruster Foot is larger than the width of the foot on one side and would over-hang on one side, except the excess was trimmed off with a razor knife. (Photo posted at: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/amelyachtowners/photos/albums/1196149903

The Amel-supplied replacements are identical and will need have the over-hang trimmed off too if they are not to over-hang.  Is this normal? (Last service, seals in photo done by Amel Martinique.)

 

3. Where is the Prop Shaft Lip Seal? Is it in the hub of the propeller, flush with the 6 nylon screws that hold the prop on, or is it behind the prop in the foot? I removed the 6 nylon screws from the prop but it will not come off.  The seal in the hub of the prop, flush with the nylon screws, is smaller than the Amel-supplied prop shaft seal so I presume the lip seal is in the trunk behind the prop. If so, any suggestions on how to get the prop off with the 6 nylon screws removed?


Again, thanks for any help and please forgive me for demonstrating my ignorance.


Jim

SM384 Sirena Azul

Seattle
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