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[Amel Yacht Owners] Super Maramu 2000 Dodgers
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Anne-Sophie Schmitt <nearlynothing@...>
Thank you for the suggestion. I want something more
substantial however. Perhaps it is the fact that I sail in cold seas as well as warm. Thanks again. Claude Roessiger --- hollambyuk <hollamby@compuserve.com> wrote: Since 1989 we have lived and cruised as far as __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com
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lionel_marais <lionel_marais@...>
I am not an Amel Yacht owner yet, but I have been aiming for several
years at becoming a Super Maramu owner, one of the very few boats I would consider changing to from our beloved Endurance 35. As decision time comes closer (meaning as cumulative savings make it feasible to consider a jump from dream world to reality) one has to consider in details advantages and drawbacks of various options within the limited selection of boats and within the possible specifications for each model. This is obviously not the purpose of the amelyachtowners site, but I am glad to find here feedback from more enthusiastic owners with years of sailing experience than I could ever meet. The dodger/bimini/awning question keeps creeping back when comparing boats, and it is apparently one question for which some Super Maramu owners have found various solutions with various degrees of satisfaction. Amel themselves have altered the design raising the back, and offering to cut clear windows in the vinyl… but these alterations come short of offering a real alternative to the fully open cockpit with temporary vinyl-canvas shelter. Other boat builders like Hallberg Rassy (http://www.hallberg-rassy.se) (see Hallberg Rassy yachts 53 and 62) offer a choice, for the same model: either dodger / bimini or hard top / dog house. Whichever you choose I feel that you are more likely to live happily with it when it is your deliberate choice. Furthermore if experience or time have you change your mind, the option remains, down the line, to replace these "appendices". The most recent Amel design appears to have reached an optimum for the dodger/bimini solution, in terms of balance between visibility through the windows and above, headroom… leaving little hope of finding, on that route, any cure for the inherent drawbacks you mentioned together with a few others like blocking the view forward when you stand in the cockpit and you are not way above 2 meters tall… The dimensions of the Super Maramu cockpit seem to present a perfect base for a hard top solution taking advantage in full of the head room available in the cockpit below the main sail boom. This would allow three large windows as you suggest, thus greatly improving the view forward. (Modern materials have allowed boat builders to design windows much larger than these, and still able to withstand battering from the sea in more exposed positions on multi- hulls) To add strength and because of the proximity of the main sail sheet, I would have the middle window not opening. (Your windshield wiper could be installed on it). The opening of the other two windows may be along a horizontal axis at the middle of the windows if a hinge at the top has the windows protruding too much forward and interfering with the main sail sheet and its pulley block. (You may even have to cut the windows in half with only the upper half opening, which would not be as good). The lateral windows could be half opening (sliding). In addition to being a much better support for larger clear top windows/openings as you suggest, a hard top extending all the way to the mizzen mast could me made very strong with some attachment to the mast, without the need for thick reinforcement. (We seek shelter from the sun but would also like to keep as much shelter as possible in bad weather when vinyl-canvas extensions may have to be taken down). A complete cockpit hard top cover would improve safety (no weird angle) when going in and out of the cockpit. There is plenty of height, as can be experienced with the present bimini, for a continuous hard top not to present any significant hindrance: hand- rails properly positioned on top would even help when moving about. This roof could be a good support for solar panels. Complete closure of the cockpit would certainly be easier to design and attach on a fix structure, adding a proper temporary deck saloon to the living space. This hard top being an added piece could be removed without too much additional fuss, if need be, for engine or generator removal. Having done some touch up on drawings and photos, I think the overall silhouette could be quite pleasant. I would be very interested to know whether and how you bring your ideas to fruition or if you give up, why you give up. --- In amelyachtowners@y..., Anne-Sophie Schmitt <nearlynothing@y...> wrote: Thank you for the suggestion. I want something more
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Anne-Sophie Schmitt <nearlynothing@...>
After considerable thought I have chosen a simpler
solution. Of course a complete new unit can be well built, and aesthetically designed. But, to do it right, it is a very expensive proposition, by my estimates USD 20,000. minimum, likely more. And, there are various fit issues which develop from almost any "100% hardtop" solution chosen. So, I have a proposal from a sailmaker/awningmaker to make a new extensible dodger, retaining the Amel windscreen and hard dodger portion. The new dodger will: 1. Be much more rigid, "taught" if you will. 2. Continue the windscreen line directly, by fitting a new attachment extrusion at the forward line of the windscreen. 3. Rise up immediately to the full dodger height--only attained in the aftmost bow on the Amel design--and incorporate two narrow horizontal windows above the Amel windscreen windows, giving improved forward visibility. 4. Incorporate a mainsail sight window in the roof with a sun shade. 5. Allow the collapsing of this new dodger almost as completely as the Amel design, although it will of necessity collapse above the point of the Amel dodger. 6. Fit a much stronger aft bow, as the Amel aft bow no doubt suffices for the dodger but not for the habit of people to use it to hang on to at sea. 7. Of necessity fit a new "forward-most" bow to support the more forward position of the new dodger. 8. Be made of double-layer canvas. This will be done for about USD 2500., and I believe it will give 80% of what a hard dodger conversion might have given. Moreover, if I wish to return the boat to "factory original" it will be an easy thing. This leaves the window problem. I think I will solve it very simply, as Amel had already solved it on the Maramu/Mango, with a "window within the window" which allows visibility and ventilation. If the details are unclear please let me know and I'll be glad to clarify them. Best regards, Claude Roessiger --- lionel_marais <lionel_marais@yahoo.com> wrote: I am not an Amel Yacht owner yet, but I have been __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/
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Krassopoulos Dimitris <dkra@...>
It is very interesting to receive e-mail from non Amel owner but believe me
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
that you first to sail in an Amel to understand the boat. No there is no need for a hard top on the SM 2000. The design is absolute ok depending ofcource of your sail area. If you planning to sail in the Antarctica it is necessary but as a comprise for the main sailing destinations is the optimum. The Hallberg Rassy hard top is necessary for Scandinavian sailing but not for mediteranean or tropical conditions. When you install the two new designed side screens is absolutely dry even with high seas and comfortable as a hardtop and ofcource foldable when the conditions allow it.The handles installed on the hard part are very useful to step out. The awning extension for sun protection is very well designed and very easily installed. My only suggestion to Amel would be to make the second windscreen also openable as the drivers windscreen I really do not understand why they do not make the design symmetrical. Best Regards Dimitris Krassopoulos S/Y Alma Libre www.almalibre.gr <http://www.almalibre.gr>;
-----Original Message-----
From: lionel_marais [mailto:lionel_marais@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2002 3:28 PM To: amelyachtowners@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Amel Yacht Owners] Super Maramu 2000 Dodgers I am not an Amel Yacht owner yet, but I have been aiming for several years at becoming a Super Maramu owner, one of the very few boats I would consider changing to from our beloved Endurance 35. As decision time comes closer (meaning as cumulative savings make it feasible to consider a jump from dream world to reality) one has to consider in details advantages and drawbacks of various options within the limited selection of boats and within the possible specifications for each model. This is obviously not the purpose of the amelyachtowners site, but I am glad to find here feedback from more enthusiastic owners with years of sailing experience than I could ever meet. The dodger/bimini/awning question keeps creeping back when comparing boats, and it is apparently one question for which some Super Maramu owners have found various solutions with various degrees of satisfaction. Amel themselves have altered the design raising the back, and offering to cut clear windows in the vinyl... but these alterations come short of offering a real alternative to the fully open cockpit with temporary vinyl-canvas shelter. Other boat builders like Hallberg Rassy (http://www.hallberg-rassy.se) <http://www.hallberg-rassy.se)> (see Hallberg Rassy yachts 53 and 62) offer a choice, for the same model: either dodger / bimini or hard top / dog house. Whichever you choose I feel that you are more likely to live happily with it when it is your deliberate choice. Furthermore if experience or time have you change your mind, the option remains, down the line, to replace these "appendices". The most recent Amel design appears to have reached an optimum for the dodger/bimini solution, in terms of balance between visibility through the windows and above, headroom... leaving little hope of finding, on that route, any cure for the inherent drawbacks you mentioned together with a few others like blocking the view forward when you stand in the cockpit and you are not way above 2 meters tall... The dimensions of the Super Maramu cockpit seem to present a perfect base for a hard top solution taking advantage in full of the head room available in the cockpit below the main sail boom. This would allow three large windows as you suggest, thus greatly improving the view forward. (Modern materials have allowed boat builders to design windows much larger than these, and still able to withstand battering from the sea in more exposed positions on multi- hulls) To add strength and because of the proximity of the main sail sheet, I would have the middle window not opening. (Your windshield wiper could be installed on it). The opening of the other two windows may be along a horizontal axis at the middle of the windows if a hinge at the top has the windows protruding too much forward and interfering with the main sail sheet and its pulley block. (You may even have to cut the windows in half with only the upper half opening, which would not be as good). The lateral windows could be half opening (sliding). In addition to being a much better support for larger clear top windows/openings as you suggest, a hard top extending all the way to the mizzen mast could me made very strong with some attachment to the mast, without the need for thick reinforcement. (We seek shelter from the sun but would also like to keep as much shelter as possible in bad weather when vinyl-canvas extensions may have to be taken down). A complete cockpit hard top cover would improve safety (no weird angle) when going in and out of the cockpit. There is plenty of height, as can be experienced with the present bimini, for a continuous hard top not to present any significant hindrance: hand- rails properly positioned on top would even help when moving about. This roof could be a good support for solar panels. Complete closure of the cockpit would certainly be easier to design and attach on a fix structure, adding a proper temporary deck saloon to the living space. This hard top being an added piece could be removed without too much additional fuss, if need be, for engine or generator removal. Having done some touch up on drawings and photos, I think the overall silhouette could be quite pleasant. I would be very interested to know whether and how you bring your ideas to fruition or if you give up, why you give up. --- In amelyachtowners@y..., Anne-Sophie Schmitt <nearlynothing@y...> wrote: Thank you for the suggestion. I want something more Yahoo! 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