Topics

Boat Insurance During Pandemic

Drew Gaffney
 

Pantaenius has stopped offering insurance in the US and will not insure US Flagged boats, even imported in the EU.  My previous carrier will not write new policies for countries currently in “Lockdown”.
Does anyone have any suggestions regarding where to obtain insurance for our Amel in Sardinia, IT.
Thanks,
Drew
SV Revelation SM390
Lying Carloforte, Sardinia.

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hi Drew;

 

We insure through Alliance Marine Risk Managers in Florida. They seem to do OK for EU area for US flagged boats. Here’s our contact. Let her know I sent you and she should take good care of you.

 

Terri Saxon

Vice President

Alliance Marine Risk Managers

777 SE 20th Street, Suite 230

Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33316

954-982-2502

Terri.saxon@...

 

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Drew Gaffney via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2020 1:55 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: [AmelYachtOwners] Boat Insurance During Pandemic

 

Pantaenius has stopped offering insurance in the US and will not insure US Flagged boats, even imported in the EU.  My previous carrier will not write new policies for countries currently in “Lockdown”.
Does anyone have any suggestions regarding where to obtain insurance for our Amel in Sardinia, IT.
Thanks,
Drew
SV Revelation SM390
Lying Carloforte, Sardinia.

Porter McRoberts
 

This “boat insurance companies dropping policies” movement since Maria and Irma evades my understanding. I’m wondering if someone has some insight. I understand how the real or perceived risk has increased with global warming and storm frequency increases, but why then not just increase premiums to offset risk?  Why so many getting out of the business? Seems like something more, structural is afoot.  Anyone with insights?  
Appreciated. 
Porter McRoberts S/V IBIS. 
A54-152

On Apr 16, 2020, at 4:54 PM, Drew Gaffney <drew.gaffney@...> wrote:

Pantaenius has stopped offering insurance in the US and will not insure US Flagged boats, even imported in the EU.  My previous carrier will not write new policies for countries currently in “Lockdown”.
Does anyone have any suggestions regarding where to obtain insurance for our Amel in Sardinia, IT.
Thanks,
Drew
SV Revelation SM390
Lying Carloforte, Sardinia.

 

All US Amel Owners,

Here is what I think: The change in the marine insurance business started in about 2011-2012 when large companies began to swallow smaller ones. The first sign we saw was the ridiculous denial of legitimate claims from some of these companies. Do you remember the episode with NIKIMAT insured by Helvetia? The next thing I saw was legally manipulated policy language which gave almost all rights to the companies. More recently, we see most of the rest of the companies who chose not to wrongfully deny claims or write unfair policies simply leave the marine market. Of course, insurance company losses caused a lot of this.

I believe that if I were in the market today, I would self-insure for all casualty losses and write a liability-only policy. If you are a US boat and have trouble finding an insurance policy or a liability-only policy (third-Party), I suggest that you contact Gary Golden, Manifest Marine. Manifest Marine was established in 2016 in the wake of its founder, Gary Golden, selling his interest in International Marine Insurance Services (IMIS), an agency he co‑founded in 1987.
CONTACT:
Manifest Marine  
604 Stonewall Lane
Fredericksburg, Virginia 22407
410-490-9020
Gary Golden, Director: Gary@...
I really like Gary and he is a knowledgeable insurance specialist for the marine market.

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 6:35 PM Porter McRoberts via groups.io <portermcroberts=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
This “boat insurance companies dropping policies” movement since Maria and Irma evades my understanding. I’m wondering if someone has some insight. I understand how the real or perceived risk has increased with global warming and storm frequency increases, but why then not just increase premiums to offset risk?  Why so many getting out of the business? Seems like something more, structural is afoot.  Anyone with insights?  
Appreciated. 
Porter McRoberts S/V IBIS. 
A54-152

On Apr 16, 2020, at 4:54 PM, Drew Gaffney <drew.gaffney@...> wrote:

Pantaenius has stopped offering insurance in the US and will not insure US Flagged boats, even imported in the EU.  My previous carrier will not write new policies for countries currently in “Lockdown”.
Does anyone have any suggestions regarding where to obtain insurance for our Amel in Sardinia, IT.
Thanks,
Drew
SV Revelation SM390
Lying Carloforte, Sardinia.

Teun BAAS
 

Porter,

 

In 2018 I was insured with a LLOYDS South Pacific syndicate via an agency in NOUMEA NC. Last year I was told by somebody in that NC agency that LLOYDS no longer wanted to renew/write policies. Wow – not happy and questioning further apparently there was a misunderstanding internally in the NC agency as then my own agent came back with another proposal; surprisingly also from LLOYDS but roughly USD400 higher than previous year but with a higher agreed value. I accepted immediately but when I asked what happened he explained that LLOYDS no longer wanted to write NEW CALEDONIA nationals but when they realized I was not a NC national they wrote me again. I am Dutch, the boat is UK owned but Dutch registered.

Researching this further I noticed that the NC agency had in both cases their PAPEETE office handle & issue the policy and I was actually dealing with somebody in PAPEETE.

A couple of months ago a fellow A54 owner (USA national), also sailing in the SP, was dropped by his insurance and struggling to get coverage and I referred him to my PAPEETE agent and he got written/covered by the LLOYDS syndicate. Hearing this I didn’t worry about my renewal next week UNTIL I was informed last week that LLOYDS didn’t renew policies anymore. My PAPEETE agent gave me this explanation:  “Our two Lloyd's syndicates, as well as many other insurers, left the yacht market at the beginning or 2020. There are less and less insurers for this class or insurance in Tropical areas, that's for that reason that the premium level is increasing a lot” He then came last week with a proposal 3 ½ times higher than my current premium which I declined.

Last night send sent me another proposal which is acceptable to me but we are working on getting a combination of hard storage and then when I go actually back into the water activate this new policy.

Until I was informed last night of this other option I was really concerned but it looks we found an acceptable solution.

Best Regards Teun

SV AMELIT  A54  #128

 

Currently on the hard in COOMERA (near BRISBANE) QLD AUSTRALIA

April 16, 2020 18:30:55

 

USA cell: +1 832 477 8842

AUSTRALIA cell: +61 5951 8909

 

You can follow AMELIT via this link: https://forecast.predictwind.com/tracking/display/AMELIT

            

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Porter McRoberts via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2020 16:36
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Boat Insurance During Pandemic

 

This “boat insurance companies dropping policies” movement since Maria and Irma evades my understanding. I’m wondering if someone has some insight. I understand how the real or perceived risk has increased with global warming and storm frequency increases, but why then not just increase premiums to offset risk?  Why so many getting out of the business? Seems like something more, structural is afoot.  Anyone with insights?  

Appreciated. 

Porter McRoberts S/V IBIS. 

A54-152



On Apr 16, 2020, at 4:54 PM, Drew Gaffney <drew.gaffney@...> wrote:

Pantaenius has stopped offering insurance in the US and will not insure US Flagged boats, even imported in the EU.  My previous carrier will not write new policies for countries currently in “Lockdown”.
Does anyone have any suggestions regarding where to obtain insurance for our Amel in Sardinia, IT.
Thanks,
Drew
SV Revelation SM390
Lying Carloforte, Sardinia.

Matt Salatino
 

Second on recommending Gary Golden, Manifest Marine. He himself is a boat owner, Moody 46....

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Apr 17, 2020, at 2:46 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

All US Amel Owners,

Here is what I think: The change in the marine insurance business started in about 2011-2012 when large companies began to swallow smaller ones. The first sign we saw was the ridiculous denial of legitimate claims from some of these companies. Do you remember the episode with NIKIMAT insured by Helvetia? The next thing I saw was legally manipulated policy language which gave almost all rights to the companies. More recently, we see most of the rest of the companies who chose not to wrongfully deny claims or write unfair policies simply leave the marine market. Of course, insurance company losses caused a lot of this.

I believe that if I were in the market today, I would self-insure for all casualty losses and write a liability-only policy. If you are a US boat and have trouble finding an insurance policy or a liability-only policy (third-Party), I suggest that you contact Gary Golden, Manifest Marine. Manifest Marine was established in 2016 in the wake of its founder, Gary Golden, selling his interest in International Marine Insurance Services (IMIS), an agency he co‑founded in 1987.
CONTACT:
Manifest Marine  
604 Stonewall Lane
Fredericksburg, Virginia 22407
410-490-9020
Gary Golden, Director: Gary@...
I really like Gary and he is a knowledgeable insurance specialist for the marine market.

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 6:35 PM Porter McRoberts via groups.io <portermcroberts=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
This “boat insurance companies dropping policies” movement since Maria and Irma evades my understanding. I’m wondering if someone has some insight. I understand how the real or perceived risk has increased with global warming and storm frequency increases, but why then not just increase premiums to offset risk?  Why so many getting out of the business? Seems like something more, structural is afoot.  Anyone with insights?  
Appreciated. 
Porter McRoberts S/V IBIS. 
A54-152

On Apr 16, 2020, at 4:54 PM, Drew Gaffney <drew.gaffney@...> wrote:

Pantaenius has stopped offering insurance in the US and will not insure US Flagged boats, even imported in the EU.  My previous carrier will not write new policies for countries currently in “Lockdown”.
Does anyone have any suggestions regarding where to obtain insurance for our Amel in Sardinia, IT.
Thanks,
Drew
SV Revelation SM390
Lying Carloforte, Sardinia.

VICTOR MOLERO
 

Hello all.
I can share my experience with Sergio Ponce, the insurance specialist located in Spain, who has done a superb job at finding the best insurance company in any given moment. He calls me every year and tells me whether I should remain with the same company, or change to a different one because of price, coverage or policies. Last year I was with Generali and this year he's moving me to AXA. A few years back I had an accident and I didn't even call the company: I called him and he took care of everything. If anyone wants to contact him here's his email sergioponce@...
Best 
Victor SM#314

Ralf Schroeder
 

Hi Drew,

is your flag US or once of EU?

My dealer inform me, that the problem here in EU is the US Law when your ship has a US flag. And this is the problem of some insurances from EU.
When this is correct, he advice me to ask a insurance from GB. They have the same problem through the brexit and help you with a US flag, hopefully.

Best wishes
Ralf
SV Baghira
Sharki #42

Trevor Lusty
 

Hi Drew,
               Chris McGeown of Topsail in the UK could also be worth a try. I moved to them around 2010 when Allianz stopped offering cover outside Europe and I have been with them ever since. My boats are always irish flagged so they obviously write policies outside the UK.
With Allianz I was able to sit down with the marine underwriter every year and discuss where I was hoping to go and negotiate the premium.
Something that they pointed out was the the bias on the premium was not for the repairs or replacement, but for shipping the boat back to a yard that could actually carry out any repair work required to a satisfactory standard.
Topsail offer OCC members additional discount.
It is also worth remembering that wherever  the policy is written, that country's legal system is what you are going to have to deal with should you get embroiled in a nasty claim.
Good luck.
Trevor Lusty
Ireland

Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hi Drew;

 

Thanks for the info. Do you have an e-mail address for Chris McGeown?

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Trevor Lusty via groups.io
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2020 9:26 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Boat Insurance During Pandemic

 

Hi Drew,
               Chris McGeown of Topsail in the UK could also be worth a try. I moved to them around 2010 when Allianz stopped offering cover outside Europe and I have been with them ever since. My boats are always irish flagged so they obviously write policies outside the UK.
With Allianz I was able to sit down with the marine underwriter every year and discuss where I was hoping to go and negotiate the premium.
Something that they pointed out was the the bias on the premium was not for the repairs or replacement, but for shipping the boat back to a yard that could actually carry out any repair work required to a satisfactory standard.
Topsail offer OCC members additional discount.
It is also worth remembering that wherever  the policy is written, that country's legal system is what you are going to have to deal with should you get embroiled in a nasty claim.
Good luck.
Trevor Lusty
Ireland

Trevor Lusty
 



Sorry Mohammad, I misspelt his name earlier. Peter Killen former owner of SM Pure Magic originally recommended Topsail to me.
Regards,
Trevor 

Chris McGowan
Director | Topsail Insurance Ltd. 
4-6 Octagon Offices, Waterfront, Brighton Marina, Brighton, BN2 5WB
Direct Dial.         + 44 (0) 1273 573 722
Phone.              + 44 (0) 1273 573 727 
Email.                chris@...
Website.            www.topsailinsurance.com

Miles
 

For anyone still looking for insurance,  Mark Gargula at Gowrie in Newport just found suitable insurance for me.  It is not hugely more than the Pantaenius that is ending soon.  It is for the east coast of the US, Bermuda, and the Caribbean only; and I will not be in the hurricane area until after 1 November, so that makes it easier.   I have been with Gowrie for many years, including a significant claim; and I can recommend them.

 

Regards to all,

 

Miles, s/y Ladybug, sm216, under lockdown in Le Marin, Martinique.

 

Mark Gargula | Marine & Personal Insurance Specialist 

Gowrie Group | A division of Risk Strategies

markg@...

p: 860.399.3677 | c: 860.391.7371

449 Thames Street, Suite 210, Newport RI 02840

www.gowrie.com

 

eric freedman
 

Hi Miles,

Do you  have to do an out of water survey?

Fair Winds

Eric

Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io [mailto:main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io] On Behalf Of Miles
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2020 6:32 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Boat Insurance During Pandemic

 

For anyone still looking for insurance,  Mark Gargula at Gowrie in Newport just found suitable insurance for me.  It is not hugely more than the Pantaenius that is ending soon.  It is for the east coast of the US, Bermuda, and the Caribbean only; and I will not be in the hurricane area until after 1 November, so that makes it easier.   I have been with Gowrie for many years, including a significant claim; and I can recommend them.

 

Regards to all,

 

Miles, s/y Ladybug, sm216, under lockdown in Le Marin, Martinique.

 

Mark Gargula | Marine & Personal Insurance Specialist 

Gowrie Group | A division of Risk Strategies

markg@...

p: 860.399.3677 | c: 860.391.7371

449 Thames Street, Suite 210, Newport RI 02840

www.gowrie.com