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Covid, Spanish VAT and the18 month temporary importation rule

Joerg Esdorn
 

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
CW Bill Rouse
 

Joerg,

For what it is worth, I found the strictest countries to be Spain and Greece and the most liberal, Malta. Of course, this was my experience several years ago, and as you know the customs officer that you approach varies, some strict, some not. Some Ships Agents get away with everything, some get away with nothing. Some owners are shown leniency from an official, while the same official is strict with another vessel's owner. 

Another side note: I really hated to meet with a customs official who was just "lectured to" by an English speaking person, telling him how to do his job. That official assumed the worst with me, simply because I spoke English.

I would try another Ship's Agent, hopefully 3rd-party recommended. I heard that these disputes can wind up in a local court with a judge making the final decision. Even though this can be expensive hiring a lawyer, in the end, this could be good for you, unless the judge had a not-so-good experience with someone he associates with you (like my example above).

I hope this helps, at least somewhat.

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:25 AM Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
Elja Röllinghoff Balu SM 222
 

He Joerg

why don't you check if you can sail to England? Thy leave the eu some month ago.

if it is allowed to enter the EU for us members
furthermore , entry restrictions are in place to the EU .




Von meinem iPhone gesendet
Gerhard Mueller
 

It is right what Bill is telling. But I'm afraid the europaen people has changed their mind about the US since the changes in US politics.
I see more and more people in Europe since some years talking bad about the US now. Hopefully that will change after the elections.
--
Gerhard Mueller
Amel Sharki #60
Currently Kalamata, Greece
James Alton
 

Bill,

   Depending on when Greece reopens to US travellers, I am potentially in a very similar situation with regard to the VAT and the 18 month limit.  My boat is located in Preveza, Greece and I have been using an agent there named Sofia to handle the paperwork.  I inquired with her on this issue and received the response posted below:

Hello
James
As long as the transit log deposit to the the customs office the clock is stopped
So the sueno can stay without VAT mire time than 18 months.


Beat regards
Sofia Gravani
Agency manager

(Sofia placed the transit log for Sueño with the customs office last October)

Despite this positive response I am still concerned about going over the 18 month limit.  Do you feel that this information is adequate or should I follow up and try to verify this information?  If you recommend that I verify then would you know who I should contact?

Thanks,

James Alton
SV Sueño
Maramu #220

On Aug 3, 2020, at 9:49 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

Joerg,

For what it is worth, I found the strictest countries to be Spain and Greece and the most liberal, Malta. Of course, this was my experience several years ago, and as you know the customs officer that you approach varies, some strict, some not. Some Ships Agents get away with everything, some get away with nothing. Some owners are shown leniency from an official, while the same official is strict with another vessel's owner. 

Another side note: I really hated to meet with a customs official who was just "lectured to" by an English speaking person, telling him how to do his job. That official assumed the worst with me, simply because I spoke English.

I would try another Ship's Agent, hopefully 3rd-party recommended. I heard that these disputes can wind up in a local court with a judge making the final decision. Even though this can be expensive hiring a lawyer, in the end, this could be good for you, unless the judge had a not-so-good experience with someone he associates with you (like my example above).

I hope this helps, at least somewhat.

Bill


CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
  
View My Training Calendar


On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:25 AM Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
Elja Röllinghoff Balu SM 222
 

Hey, Bill
yes, I think this is a matter that can be brought to court , but that would have the risk that the boat will be set up to the verdict or the tax will be deposited .
i would ask a specialist for EU tax law about the exceptions to be provided for here, and I would not rely on the Spanish authorities alone.

Moreover , I must agree with Gerhard , and why should the Spanish be generous in this area , they need every cent

Elja
SM Balu
Kalamata

Von meinem iPhone gesendet
Roque
 

Joerg. You could try to reach Barbara at info@....  Whatsapp +34  620 87 50 97. She lives in Alicante, and used to be the Amel representative in Spain. Bárbara handled everything I needed during almost 4 years while sailing in the Med.  She became a good friend, since. Even if she can’t help you directly, she may point you to the right direction. She speaks English.  Good luck. 

Roque
Attika  A54 #117
Paraty - Brazil

Em seg., 3 de ago. de 2020 às 10:25, Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> escreveu:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
JB Duler
 

Another reliable option is to hire a captain to take her to Tunisia. I have used the Marina Monestir in the past. If you are in the Med, it is an easy trip. Sometimes at this time of the year it involves just motoring on a flat Med, just like glass.

If you are in Vigo, other non EEU options are Morocco (super easy) and  Guernesey, if they have room (more difficult). Sailing North and around Britany could be complicated (storms + massive tides).

This is unfortunate and I am painfully aware of the various trade related disputes between the US and Europe. The US has shown little flexibility, if any, so I would expect the same in return from Europe.

JB
San Francisco

Em seg., 3 de ago. de 2020 às 10:25, Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> escreveu:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
Alexandre Uster von Baar
 

France will certainly not be “more” helpful.  

Don’t play game with the customs, especially not the French.  

“They” will decided on the value of your boat to charge you the 20% VAT.  

Can’t you sail to Morocco, Tunisia, Turkey?  Any non-EU country?  


Sincerely, Alexandre


On Monday, August 3, 2020, 08:24:10 AM CDT, Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313@...> wrote:


My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
Mohammad Shirloo
 

When we were wintering in Greece, this is the same information we were told. The time that the cruising permit is surrendered to customs, is not counted towards the 18 month time limit.

 

However, opinions and responses vary drastically in the EU, depending on the country and the official you are talking to. We did take this issue seriously, but in our 6 years of cruising the Med, we have never been faced with an inquiry from any official regarding the amount of time Kokomo has been in EU waters.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of James Alton via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 03, 2020 7:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Covid, Spanish VAT and the18 month temporary importation rule

 

Bill,

 

   Depending on when Greece reopens to US travellers, I am potentially in a very similar situation with regard to the VAT and the 18 month limit.  My boat is located in Preveza, Greece and I have been using an agent there named Sofia to handle the paperwork.  I inquired with her on this issue and received the response posted below:

 

Hello

James

As long as the transit log deposit to the the customs office the clock is stopped

So the sueno can stay without VAT mire time than 18 months.

 

 

Beat regards

Sofia Gravani

Agency manager

 

(Sofia placed the transit log for Sueño with the customs office last October)

 

Despite this positive response I am still concerned about going over the 18 month limit.  Do you feel that this information is adequate or should I follow up and try to verify this information?  If you recommend that I verify then would you know who I should contact?

 

Thanks,

 

James Alton

SV Sueño

Maramu #220

 

On Aug 3, 2020, at 9:49 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

 

Joerg,

 

For what it is worth, I found the strictest countries to be Spain and Greece and the most liberal, Malta. Of course, this was my experience several years ago, and as you know the customs officer that you approach varies, some strict, some not. Some Ships Agents get away with everything, some get away with nothing. Some owners are shown leniency from an official, while the same official is strict with another vessel's owner. 

 

Another side note: I really hated to meet with a customs official who was just "lectured to" by an English speaking person, telling him how to do his job. That official assumed the worst with me, simply because I spoke English.

 

I would try another Ship's Agent, hopefully 3rd-party recommended. I heard that these disputes can wind up in a local court with a judge making the final decision. Even though this can be expensive hiring a lawyer, in the end, this could be good for you, unless the judge had a not-so-good experience with someone he associates with you (like my example above).

 

I hope this helps, at least somewhat.

 

Bill

 

 

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School

Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 

  

 

View My Training Calendar

 

 

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:25 AM Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain

 

 

 
Matt Salatino
 

How about the Channel Islands, or Gibraltar?

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 3, 2020, at 3:24 PM, Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313@...> wrote:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
Steven Nieman
 

I would sail to Malta and pay the 6% import tax. 🤓

Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone

Op 3 aug. 2020 om 16:11 heeft Elja Röllinghoff Balu SM 222 <Bijorka@gmx.de> het volgende geschreven:

He Joerg

why don't you check if you can sail to England? Thy leave the eu some month ago.

if it is allowed to enter the EU for us members
furthermore , entry restrictions are in place to the EU .




Von meinem iPhone gesendet
James Alton
 

Mohammad and Aty,

   Thanks for this information and also for the warning about opinions and responses possibly varying with officials.  I am hoping to return to the boat in time to have the option to make a short trip to either Albania or Montenegro before the time actually runs out.  We had a wonderful time in Montenegro in 2019 btw.  Does anyone have any advice for visiting at least the South portion of Albania to get the clock reset on the VAT issue?  Our destination will actually be Izmir to have the boat measured for new sails so Albania is going in the wrong direction but I don’t think there would be enough time to reach Izmir without going over the 18 month limit.  Cruising has certainly become more complicated!

Thanks again!

Best,
James
SV Sueño
Maramu #220

   

   
On Aug 3, 2020, at 11:26 AM, Mohammad Shirloo <mshirloo@...> wrote:

When we were wintering in Greece, this is the same information we were told. The time that the cruising permit is surrendered to customs, is not counted towards the 18 month time limit.
 
However, opinions and responses vary drastically in the EU, depending on the country and the official you are talking to. We did take this issue seriously, but in our 6 years of cruising the Med, we have never been faced with an inquiry from any official regarding the amount of time Kokomo has been in EU waters.
 
Happy Sailing;
 
 
Mohammad and Aty
B&B Kokomo
AMEL 54 #099
 
From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of James Alton via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 03, 2020 7:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Covid, Spanish VAT and the18 month temporary importation rule
 
Bill,
 
   Depending on when Greece reopens to US travellers, I am potentially in a very similar situation with regard to the VAT and the 18 month limit.  My boat is located in Preveza, Greece and I have been using an agent there named Sofia to handle the paperwork.  I inquired with her on this issue and received the response posted below:
 
Hello
James
As long as the transit log deposit to the the customs office the clock is stopped
So the sueno can stay without VAT mire time than 18 months.
 
 
Beat regards
Sofia Gravani
Agency manager
 
(Sofia placed the transit log for Sueño with the customs office last October)
 
Despite this positive response I am still concerned about going over the 18 month limit.  Do you feel that this information is adequate or should I follow up and try to verify this information?  If you recommend that I verify then would you know who I should contact?
 
Thanks,
 
James Alton
SV Sueño
Maramu #220
 
On Aug 3, 2020, at 9:49 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:
 
Joerg,
 
For what it is worth, I found the strictest countries to be Spain and Greece and the most liberal, Malta. Of course, this was my experience several years ago, and as you know the customs officer that you approach varies, some strict, some not. Some Ships Agents get away with everything, some get away with nothing. Some owners are shown leniency from an official, while the same official is strict with another vessel's owner. 
 
Another side note: I really hated to meet with a customs official who was just "lectured to" by an English speaking person, telling him how to do his job. That official assumed the worst with me, simply because I spoke English.
 
I would try another Ship's Agent, hopefully 3rd-party recommended. I heard that these disputes can wind up in a local court with a judge making the final decision. Even though this can be expensive hiring a lawyer, in the end, this could be good for you, unless the judge had a not-so-good experience with someone he associates with you (like my example above).
 
I hope this helps, at least somewhat.
 
Bill
 
 
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
  

 
 
On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:25 AM Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!

joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
 
 
 
Matt Salatino
 

We are US-flagged, in Gibraltar now, on the Spanish side (Marina Alcaidesa). We took a bike trip into Gibraltar, and stopped at Queensway Marina to ask if we could restart our 18 month clock by checking into their marina for one night. They said yes, and they could handle the clearance particulars for us. We are not running out f time, but might do this before we move into the Med, just as insurance.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Aug 3, 2020, at 5:20 PM, Alexandre Uster von Baar via groups.io <uster@...> wrote:

France will certainly not be “more” helpful.  

Don’t play game with the customs, especially not the French.  

“They” will decided on the value of your boat to charge you the 20% VAT.  

Can’t you sail to Morocco, Tunisia, Turkey?  Any non-EU country?  


Sincerely, Alexandre


On Monday, August 3, 2020, 08:24:10 AM CDT, Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313@...> wrote:


My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain
Mohammad Shirloo
 

Hi James;

 

We are currently wintering ( And “summering” I guess) in Montenegro. We highly recommend Montenegro, especially Porto Montenegro. We cruised Albania for a week last year. If you are just planning on checking in and out, Saranda will be a great option. It is only a few miles across from Corfu. An agent was referred to us by our agent (and now a good friend) in Corfu. She was very professional and took care of everything. The dock in Saranda is not the best, but will be safe, if no southerly component to the wind conditions.

 

Let me know if you need the agent’s contact information.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of James Alton via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 03, 2020 10:17 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Covid, Spanish VAT and the18 month temporary importation rule

 

Mohammad and Aty,

 

   Thanks for this information and also for the warning about opinions and responses possibly varying with officials.  I am hoping to return to the boat in time to have the option to make a short trip to either Albania or Montenegro before the time actually runs out.  We had a wonderful time in Montenegro in 2019 btw.  Does anyone have any advice for visiting at least the South portion of Albania to get the clock reset on the VAT issue?  Our destination will actually be Izmir to have the boat measured for new sails so Albania is going in the wrong direction but I don’t think there would be enough time to reach Izmir without going over the 18 month limit.  Cruising has certainly become more complicated!

 

Thanks again!

 

Best,

James

SV Sueño

Maramu #220

 

   

 

   

On Aug 3, 2020, at 11:26 AM, Mohammad Shirloo <mshirloo@...> wrote:

 

When we were wintering in Greece, this is the same information we were told. The time that the cruising permit is surrendered to customs, is not counted towards the 18 month time limit.

 

However, opinions and responses vary drastically in the EU, depending on the country and the official you are talking to. We did take this issue seriously, but in our 6 years of cruising the Med, we have never been faced with an inquiry from any official regarding the amount of time Kokomo has been in EU waters.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of James Alton via groups.io
Sent: Monday, August 03, 2020 7:20 AM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Covid, Spanish VAT and the18 month temporary importation rule

 

Bill,

 

   Depending on when Greece reopens to US travellers, I am potentially in a very similar situation with regard to the VAT and the 18 month limit.  My boat is located in Preveza, Greece and I have been using an agent there named Sofia to handle the paperwork.  I inquired with her on this issue and received the response posted below:

 

Hello

James

As long as the transit log deposit to the the customs office the clock is stopped

So the sueno can stay without VAT mire time than 18 months.

 

 

Beat regards

Sofia Gravani

Agency manager

 

(Sofia placed the transit log for Sueño with the customs office last October)

 

Despite this positive response I am still concerned about going over the 18 month limit.  Do you feel that this information is adequate or should I follow up and try to verify this information?  If you recommend that I verify then would you know who I should contact?

 

Thanks,

 

James Alton

SV Sueño

Maramu #220

 

On Aug 3, 2020, at 9:49 AM, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> wrote:

 

Joerg,

 

For what it is worth, I found the strictest countries to be Spain and Greece and the most liberal, Malta. Of course, this was my experience several years ago, and as you know the customs officer that you approach varies, some strict, some not. Some Ships Agents get away with everything, some get away with nothing. Some owners are shown leniency from an official, while the same official is strict with another vessel's owner. 

 

Another side note: I really hated to meet with a customs official who was just "lectured to" by an English speaking person, telling him how to do his job. That official assumed the worst with me, simply because I spoke English.

 

I would try another Ship's Agent, hopefully 3rd-party recommended. I heard that these disputes can wind up in a local court with a judge making the final decision. Even though this can be expensive hiring a lawyer, in the end, this could be good for you, unless the judge had a not-so-good experience with someone he associates with you (like my example above).

 

I hope this helps, at least somewhat.

 

Bill

 

 

CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School

Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 

  

 

 

 

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:25 AM Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

My boat - US flagged - is in Spain on the hard and I am getting close to the maximum 18 months temporary importation period for VAT purposes.  Keeping the boat in Europe past the 18 months would mean that I owe VAT on the value of the boat.  Yet I cannot currently travel to the boat from the US and have had to cancel my entire season, including a sail to the Faroe Islands to get out of the EU customs zone and reset my 18 months.  The EU indicated in March that local customs offices should show flexibility in situations like mine.  So I engaged a customs agent is Spain to get me an extension of the 18 months to next summer.  They just got back to me that they could not help me.  Has anyone had success with Spanish customs (or French customs) on this issue?  I’m thinking of sailing the boat to France if the French are more helpful.  Many thanks for any help you can provide!


joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem, Vigo Spain

 

 

 

 
Joerg Esdorn
 

I tried this procedure during the winter of 2018/19 in Naftplion and was told it had been discontinued.  It has been discontinued in Spain as well, by the way.  

Joerg Esdorn
A55 Kincsem
Joerg Esdorn
 

Over the last several months, I've become an involuntary expert in all things VAT on boats in the EU.  Marocco works, so does Gibraltar (that's a change since the UK left the EU) but the Channel Islands do not work - at least not for French customs.  

Joerg Esdorn
Joerg Esdorn
 

I can second Sarande in Albania.  Very efficient and cheap.  I did it twice.  And Albania is a great tourist destination.  Renting a car and exploring the countryside and national parks is highly recommended!  
eric freedman
 

When I bought Kimberlite we sailed to Guernsey and at the time in 2002 that was acceptable with Amels agent in France.
Fair Winds,
Eric
Kimberlite

On August 3, 2020 at 6:59 PM "Joerg Esdorn via groups.io" <jhe1313@...> wrote:

Over the last several months, I've become an involuntary expert in all things VAT on boats in the EU.  Marocco works, so does Gibraltar (that's a change since the UK left the EU) but the Channel Islands do not work - at least not for French customs.  

Joerg Esdorn

 

James Alton
 

Thanks a lot for the recommendation.  If we go, we will consider the car rental idea for sure.

James
SV Sueño
Maramu #220

On Aug 3, 2020, at 7:04 PM, Joerg Esdorn via groups.io <jhe1313@...> wrote:

I can second Sarande in Albania.  Very efficient and cheap.  I did it twice.  And Albania is a great tourist destination.  Renting a car and exploring the countryside and national parks is highly recommended!  

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