Topics

Cruise and Max RPM #solution


Patrick McAneny
 

Bill, I also have an Amel about the same age as yours, and it too has the TMD22a. My engine would also run hot if I ran it much over 1800 rpm , at 2500 rpm for a few minutes I was seeing 217 degrees . I replaced the impeller ,insured water supply was unrestricted and cleaned the heat exchanger several times over a couple of years and yet still had overheating. I finally discovered my problem, and probably yours. The rubber caps on either end of the heat exchanger needed to be replaced and while ordering them online , on the side bar it showed a rubber washer/seal . I had no idea what it was for ,but bought it as well. I found a illustration showing this washer around the H/E core , when I took the core out and looked into the H/E housing ,towards the back I saw what I would call a small round  bulkhead built into the housing ,slightly larger in diameter than the core itself. The seal closes off the opening forcing the cooling water to flow thru the core rather than much of it  bypassing to core . So at low rpms the cooling was adequate to keep temps low ,but couldn't cool the water efficiently enough at higher rpms.
The washer had deteriorated and fallen off the core before I ever first took it apart, thus I never knew it existed ,I found small remnants of it later in the housing. So take your core out and see if the washer is on the core,I will bet it is gone, or pushed back too far and not sealing the opening. When you replace it ,slip it over the far end but not so far that it does not come into contact with the bulkhead opening  ,let the bulkhead push it into its proper position as you slide the core into place. 
One last tip to save a couple of hundred dollars. Buying the rubber end caps from any Volvo supplier was going to cost about $350. I found that if I ordered the caps for a Perkins M80 ,same caps ,it only cost about $55. ,the seal/washer was only a couple of dollars.
I hope this ends your overheating issues, I think it will.
Good Luck,
Pat
SM Shenanigans #123
Sassafras River ,Md.


-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Shaproski <bill.shaproski@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Group Moderators <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jul 5, 2020 7:31 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Cruise and Max RPM #solution

I have a 1995 Amel SM with a TMD22A and a MaxProp.  I used a max cruising speed of 2,000 RPM when doing my circumnavigation, but usually tried to keep it at 1800RPM.  I have cruised at 2600 RPM plus in an emergency for about 30 minutes, but the engine did get very hot.  Hope this helps.  I arrived at the 2,000RPM number by listening to the prior owner's advice.  

Regards,
Bill Shaproski
S/v Pacific Cool
206-375-2787

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020 at 8:10 AM JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> wrote:
Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


--
Bill Shaproski
Cell:  +1-206-375-2787


karkauai
 

Thank you Marco.  I still have the old Hurth transmission that was on the old Volvo.  I'll have to check its gearbox ratio.

Kent
SM 243
Kristy

On Jul 5, 2020 5:40 PM, Marco Mancini <marcomancini61@...> wrote:
Kent, we are using the same h6 was setted up by amel for the previuos TMD22 without modification. I discussed for a while with the Autoprop dealer for the defintion of the 2,3 gearbox ratio  becouse I thought in the beginning to use the same gearbox ratio of the other yanmar 100 cv installed on the SM . But this new version ( 110cv) run at maximum only at 3200 rpm instead of the 3800 rpm so we needed a smaller ratio.  The engine at its maxum reach all the 3200 rpm . Indeed the boat runs to above 9,2 Knots but she goes above her  critical velocity that with the usual formula is  8,7  knots . From what my brother is describing to me  ( I leave in Milan ) there are not vibration and the engine is very silent . 
cheers 
marco 



Il giorno 05 lug 2020, alle ore 20:09, karkauai via groups.io <karkauai@...> ha scritto:

Hi Marco,
Are you still using the AutoProp H6 with the new engine?  If yes, did you have it modified in any way?

Thanks,
Kent
SM 243
Kristy

On Jul 5, 2020 1:18 PM, Marco Mancini <marcomancini61@...> wrote:
dears,

the TMD22 with the mechanical gearbox (2,8 reduction factor) and the autoprop h6 was probably  never reached in our 20 years of SM  more than 2500 2600 rpm ,
The TMD22 engine characteristic curve show that the 78 hp ( the max power) is obtained at 3500 - 4200 rpm  but at 2500 the curve show 40 hp and the boat has never reached more than 7.5 knots 
Now we have moved to the yanmar 110 cv,  the new version of the yanmar 100) with gearbox with 2.3 rduction factor   (midway betwenn the 1.97 of amel 54 with 110 volvo and  2.8 of the yanmar 100 )  that is  the new version  of the well known  Yanmar 100 cv  installed by Amel  after the TMD22. In Italy due to a severe restrictions of  omologation certificate we had also to afford the cost of new homologation certificate but we hare happy with this change . indeed the boat seems to go much better, it has a cruise speed of 8,5  at 2300 rpm over 3200rpm ( max engine regime)  and also in the manoeuvres she is more prompt than before . 
cheers and good wind . 
marco mancini 
SM 304 




Il giorno 25 giu 2020, alle ore 16:55, Thomas Peacock <peacock8491@...> ha scritto:

This is question without a definitive answer. 
We also have the TMD22. When we bought our boat (about 4 years used), we could get almost 3,000 rpm at max throttle. Our local diesel guy suggested cruising at 80% of max, or 2,400. Our max started to lessen within about a year. 
Ever since then, we have usually not been able to max out at 3,000. Usually max is 2,400 to 2,600, so we cruise at 80% of that.
Issues affecting max cruise rpm include bottom, prop (even one barnacle can make a difference), turbo condition, and countless others. 
I suppose that, just like me, the Volvo has also lost a little mojo as it has aged. 

Tom Peacock
SM 240 Aletes
Chesapeake Bay

with its tiny keyboard

On Jun 25, 2020, at 10:10 AM, JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> wrote:

Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain





Bill Shaproski
 

Hi Frank,
Thanks for getting back to me with your very comprehensive and well written explanation.  I'll definitely check my HE when I return to Florida.  
Best Regards
Bill Shaproski

On Mon, Jul 6, 2020, 7:07 AM Patrick McAneny via groups.io <sailw32=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Bill, I also have an Amel about the same age as yours, and it too has the TMD22a. My engine would also run hot if I ran it much over 1800 rpm , at 2500 rpm for a few minutes I was seeing 217 degrees . I replaced the impeller ,insured water supply was unrestricted and cleaned the heat exchanger several times over a couple of years and yet still had overheating. I finally discovered my problem, and probably yours. The rubber caps on either end of the heat exchanger needed to be replaced and while ordering them online , on the side bar it showed a rubber washer/seal . I had no idea what it was for ,but bought it as well. I found a illustration showing this washer around the H/E core , when I took the core out and looked into the H/E housing ,towards the back I saw what I would call a small round  bulkhead built into the housing ,slightly larger in diameter than the core itself. The seal closes off the opening forcing the cooling water to flow thru the core rather than much of it  bypassing to core . So at low rpms the cooling was adequate to keep temps low ,but couldn't cool the water efficiently enough at higher rpms.
The washer had deteriorated and fallen off the core before I ever first took it apart, thus I never knew it existed ,I found small remnants of it later in the housing. So take your core out and see if the washer is on the core,I will bet it is gone, or pushed back too far and not sealing the opening. When you replace it ,slip it over the far end but not so far that it does not come into contact with the bulkhead opening  ,let the bulkhead push it into its proper position as you slide the core into place. 
One last tip to save a couple of hundred dollars. Buying the rubber end caps from any Volvo supplier was going to cost about $350. I found that if I ordered the caps for a Perkins M80 ,same caps ,it only cost about $55. ,the seal/washer was only a couple of dollars.
I hope this ends your overheating issues, I think it will.
Good Luck,
Pat
SM Shenanigans #123
Sassafras River ,Md.


-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Shaproski <bill.shaproski@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Group Moderators <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jul 5, 2020 7:31 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Cruise and Max RPM #solution

I have a 1995 Amel SM with a TMD22A and a MaxProp.  I used a max cruising speed of 2,000 RPM when doing my circumnavigation, but usually tried to keep it at 1800RPM.  I have cruised at 2600 RPM plus in an emergency for about 30 minutes, but the engine did get very hot.  Hope this helps.  I arrived at the 2,000RPM number by listening to the prior owner's advice.  

Regards,
Bill Shaproski
S/v Pacific Cool
206-375-2787

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020 at 8:10 AM JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> wrote:
Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


--
Bill Shaproski
Cell:  +1-206-375-2787


Philippe Chatton
 

Hi Jose,
I would recommend that you have your turbo checked
Kind regards 
Philippe
S/V Chameleon
Antibes, F


Le jeu. 25 juin 2020 à 16:10, JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> a écrit :
Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


Patrick McAneny
 

Jose, I have the same engine with the Max prop I have now,or the fixed prop ,I could always get to 3100 rpms and about 8.3 kts. I too recommend you check your turbo. You may want to check the throttle linkage as well ,it may have slipped.
Good Luck ,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Philippe Chatton <chattonp960@...>
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Jul 6, 2020 1:55 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Cruise and Max RPM #solution

Hi Jose,
I would recommend that you have your turbo checked
Kind regards 
Philippe
S/V Chameleon
Antibes, F


Le jeu. 25 juin 2020 à 16:10, JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> a écrit :
Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


Patrick McAneny
 

Bill, Be certain to fully seat the end caps so that the core is fully inserted in its section of the cap and tighten the clamps well,or else the raw water can exchange or mix with the antifreeze . My old caps were getting hard ,making it hard to insure a tight seal as the rubber was no longer pliable . The previous owner went so far as to put sealant/silicone in the cap. Not a good idea ,as pieces could break free and block cooling passages within the block. As I said in my previous post ,you can buy a new set of caps for about $50. ,if you buy them for a Perkins instead of a Volvo.
Good Luck,
Pat
SM Shenanigans
Sassafras River, Md.


-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Shaproski <bill.shaproski@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Group Moderators <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Jul 6, 2020 11:51 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Cruise and Max RPM #solution

Hi Frank,
Thanks for getting back to me with your very comprehensive and well written explanation.  I'll definitely check my HE when I return to Florida.  
Best Regards
Bill Shaproski

On Mon, Jul 6, 2020, 7:07 AM Patrick McAneny via groups.io <sailw32=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Bill, I also have an Amel about the same age as yours, and it too has the TMD22a. My engine would also run hot if I ran it much over 1800 rpm , at 2500 rpm for a few minutes I was seeing 217 degrees . I replaced the impeller ,insured water supply was unrestricted and cleaned the heat exchanger several times over a couple of years and yet still had overheating. I finally discovered my problem, and probably yours. The rubber caps on either end of the heat exchanger needed to be replaced and while ordering them online , on the side bar it showed a rubber washer/seal . I had no idea what it was for ,but bought it as well. I found a illustration showing this washer around the H/E core , when I took the core out and looked into the H/E housing ,towards the back I saw what I would call a small round  bulkhead built into the housing ,slightly larger in diameter than the core itself. The seal closes off the opening forcing the cooling water to flow thru the core rather than much of it  bypassing to core . So at low rpms the cooling was adequate to keep temps low ,but couldn't cool the water efficiently enough at higher rpms.
The washer had deteriorated and fallen off the core before I ever first took it apart, thus I never knew it existed ,I found small remnants of it later in the housing. So take your core out and see if the washer is on the core,I will bet it is gone, or pushed back too far and not sealing the opening. When you replace it ,slip it over the far end but not so far that it does not come into contact with the bulkhead opening  ,let the bulkhead push it into its proper position as you slide the core into place. 
One last tip to save a couple of hundred dollars. Buying the rubber end caps from any Volvo supplier was going to cost about $350. I found that if I ordered the caps for a Perkins M80 ,same caps ,it only cost about $55. ,the seal/washer was only a couple of dollars.
I hope this ends your overheating issues, I think it will.
Good Luck,
Pat
SM Shenanigans #123
Sassafras River ,Md.


-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Shaproski <bill.shaproski@...>
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io Group Moderators <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jul 5, 2020 7:31 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Cruise and Max RPM #solution

I have a 1995 Amel SM with a TMD22A and a MaxProp.  I used a max cruising speed of 2,000 RPM when doing my circumnavigation, but usually tried to keep it at 1800RPM.  I have cruised at 2600 RPM plus in an emergency for about 30 minutes, but the engine did get very hot.  Hope this helps.  I arrived at the 2,000RPM number by listening to the prior owner's advice.  

Regards,
Bill Shaproski
S/v Pacific Cool
206-375-2787

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020 at 8:10 AM JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> wrote:
Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


--
Bill Shaproski
Cell:  +1-206-375-2787


Germain Jean-Pierre
 

Late piping in... check turbo and it’s actuator

Jean-Pierre Germain, Eleuthera, SM007


On 7/07/2020, at 8:55 AM, Patrick McAneny via groups.io <sailw32@...> wrote:


Jose, I have the same engine with the Max prop I have now,or the fixed prop ,I could always get to 3100 rpms and about 8.3 kts. I too recommend you check your turbo. You may want to check the throttle linkage as well ,it may have slipped.
Good Luck ,
Pat
SM Shenanigans


-----Original Message-----
From: Philippe Chatton <chattonp960@...>
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Jul 6, 2020 1:55 pm
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Cruise and Max RPM #solution

Hi Jose,
I would recommend that you have your turbo checked
Kind regards 
Philippe
S/V Chameleon
Antibes, F


Le jeu. 25 juin 2020 à 16:10, JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> a écrit :
Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


JOSE PRIETO
 

Guys,

Once again I would like to thank all the opinions.
I removed the turbo from my boat and took it to a specialized workshop, which did a review and decarbonization. Now the engine easily reaches over 3,000 rpm.
Its great to own an Amel, but having a backup from this group its fantastic.

Cheers
--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain


 

Marco,

I attached a page from my Amel Book which my answer your question. If not, email me at brouse@...

Best,

Bill
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Jul 5, 2020 at 4:46 PM Marco Mancini <marcomancini61@...> wrote:
Bill it is nice to have your comment . 
I have to check for this .
What do you mean ? I think I don’t have sufficient knoweldge about your question.  May please provide me additiional info ? 
as you may image we carry 2 alternators one for the 12 volt engine / onan battery charger ant another one at 24 volt for the other batteries. 
cheers 


Il giorno 05 lug 2020, alle ore 21:30, CW Bill Rouse <brouse@...> ha scritto:

Did your mechanic Isolate the 12-volt negative? 
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Jul 5, 2020 at 1:10 PM karkauai via groups.io <karkauai=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Marco,
Are you still using the AutoProp H6 with the new engine?  If yes, did you have it modified in any way?

Thanks,
Kent
SM 243
Kristy

On Jul 5, 2020 1:18 PM, Marco Mancini <marcomancini61@...> wrote:
dears,

the TMD22 with the mechanical gearbox (2,8 reduction factor) and the autoprop h6 was probably  never reached in our 20 years of SM  more than 2500 2600 rpm ,
The TMD22 engine characteristic curve show that the 78 hp ( the max power) is obtained at 3500 - 4200 rpm  but at 2500 the curve show 40 hp and the boat has never reached more than 7.5 knots 
Now we have moved to the yanmar 110 cv,  the new version of the yanmar 100) with gearbox with 2.3 rduction factor   (midway betwenn the 1.97 of amel 54 with 110 volvo and  2.8 of the yanmar 100 )  that is  the new version  of the well known  Yanmar 100 cv  installed by Amel  after the TMD22. In Italy due to a severe restrictions of  omologation certificate we had also to afford the cost of new homologation certificate but we hare happy with this change . indeed the boat seems to go much better, it has a cruise speed of 8,5  at 2300 rpm over 3200rpm ( max engine regime)  and also in the manoeuvres she is more prompt than before . 
cheers and good wind . 
marco mancini 
SM 304 




Il giorno 25 giu 2020, alle ore 16:55, Thomas Peacock <peacock8491@...> ha scritto:

This is question without a definitive answer. 
We also have the TMD22. When we bought our boat (about 4 years used), we could get almost 3,000 rpm at max throttle. Our local diesel guy suggested cruising at 80% of max, or 2,400. Our max started to lessen within about a year. 
Ever since then, we have usually not been able to max out at 3,000. Usually max is 2,400 to 2,600, so we cruise at 80% of that.
Issues affecting max cruise rpm include bottom, prop (even one barnacle can make a difference), turbo condition, and countless others. 
I suppose that, just like me, the Volvo has also lost a little mojo as it has aged. 

Tom Peacock
SM 240 Aletes
Chesapeake Bay

with its tiny keyboard

On Jun 25, 2020, at 10:10 AM, JOSE PRIETO <prietomd11@...> wrote:

Hello Amelians!  I am in the process of learning my boat.  The engine is a Volvo TMD22, with autoprop h6 propeller.
I found some threads here on the forum related to this topic, but none conclusive about what is the ideal cruise rpm regime, and what is the maximum rpm?  I can't get more than 2100 rpm!
 Any suggestion?

--
Jose Prieto
SV Wayag, SM 323
Currently Alicante, Spain