Topics

Jordan series drogue.


eric freedman
 

Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


Brent Cameron
 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator

On Apr 1, 2021, 4:51 PM -0400, eric freedman <kimberlite@...>, wrote:

Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


Porter McRoberts
 

Just saw that article from the OCC too. 
It is because if your experience and article Eric that we carry one. Thank you. 

Porter McRoberts 
S/V IBIS A54-152 Moorea
WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206
Www.fouribis.net

On Apr 1, 2021, at 10:51 AM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:



Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


Porter McRoberts
 

I also know you reinforced your rear cleats too. I don’t think we will do that. So considering a yoke between two either two cleats on each side or a cleat and the main winch for possible steering. Any thoughts on that?  Negatives or positives?  Who has thought this through and has a solution other than reinforcement of the rear cleat?  Or is that the only safe method?  

Many thanks

Porter McRoberts 
S/V IBIS A54-152
WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206
Www.fouribis.net

On Apr 1, 2021, at 12:23 PM, Porter McRoberts <portermcroberts@...> wrote:

Just saw that article from the OCC too. 
It is because if your experience and article Eric that we carry one. Thank you. 

Porter McRoberts 
S/V IBIS A54-152 Moorea
WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206
Www.fouribis.net

On Apr 1, 2021, at 10:51 AM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:



Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


eric freedman
 

Hi Brent,

Retrieving it really depends on the motion of the boat.

I had my bridles made with a large eye spliced into the end of each one. When I had Kimberlite built, I had Amel super reinforce the stern cleats. First tie a line on one if the bridles and when it becomes loose bring the line and bridle around the backstays and on to the other side of   the boat.

 

Then tie a big strong line to the eye that is still connected.

A few times the boat was rolling beam to beam. I just put a few turns of the added line around my primary winch and then when the boat rolled, I just pulled the line in and waited for Kimberlite to roll to the other side. On each roll I pulled in about 8 feet of line.

 

I forgot to mention that you have to make a rounded block of wood that will bolt through the stern cleat. Just anything that will prevent the drogue from getting stuck on the stern cleat and rip the parachutes.

It doesn’t have to be fancy.

 

Most of the time Kimberlite does not roll.

Again, bring one of the bridles over to the other side.

 

Now you will need 2 or 3 people for the next step.

If you have a third person, they will guide the drogue on board-nice touch but not imperative.

 

You will need 2 people on the primary winch. One to tail it by hand as the drogue lines are too thick for the

self-tailer . Secondly you must be careful not to rip the parachutes on the taling horn.

 

One person must press the winch switch while the other tails the line.

The winch is strong enough to bring in the drogue in 50 knots of wind.

 

However, if you try to continuously use the winch, it will overheat and shut off. You will then have to let the motor cool off for a few minutes before it resets and works.  My suggestion is to tail for a minute or so and then let it cool off for a minute or so.

That works best for me.

 

I have sailed single handed in 50 knots of wind from near Bermuda to New York.

However, that was silly of me. I should have put out the drogue.

That is where I now draw the line if I am expecting an extended blow.

 

Below is an article about us in a hurricane 36 hours – 60 foot seas wind 100 knots.

 

https://www.oceannavigator.com/prepare-for-survival-conditions/

 

Dave Pelissier of Ace sailmakers in Connecticut worked with Mr. Jordan and together they developed the drogue.
I would only get one from him if it is possible.

 

25 years ago, we were in near hurricane force winds . We were told by Herb Hilgenberg not to travel further North as the winds were horrific further North.

I was in my Tartan 37 at that time.

We were on the drogue overnight. The wind died down to 40 knots and my Tartan was literally rolling beam to beam on the drogue. I called Dave at Ace sailmakers and asked why this was happening, he didn’t know but he said call Mr. Jordan,  He gave me the number and I called him. I could hear by his voice he was quite old. After listening to me he said,  “ I know what the problem is – NOT ENOUGH WIND !!”

We brought in the drogue and sailed up to Bermuda.

 

Not Enough Wind- one of my favorite stories.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Brent Cameron via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 5:31 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

 

Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator

On Apr 1, 2021, 4:51 PM -0400, eric freedman <kimberlite@...>, wrote:

Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


eric freedman
 

You are Welcome.

Fair Winds

Eric

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Porter McRoberts via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 6:23 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Just saw that article from the OCC too. 

It is because if your experience and article Eric that we carry one. Thank you. 

Porter McRoberts 

S/V IBIS A54-152 Moorea

WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206



On Apr 1, 2021, at 10:51 AM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:



Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


Brent Cameron
 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

Brent

--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


eric freedman
 

Hi Brent ,

Did you see the note I posted at 6:30 pm today?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Brent Cameron via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 7:00 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

 

Brent


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


eric freedman
 

Error in my original  !!!

 

I MEANT TO WRITE THAT YOU HAVE TO MAKE A WOOD BLOCK THAT BOLTS OVER THE STERN CHOCK NOT THE CLEAT.

I also forgot to mention that you need put chafe protection where the drogue rubs against the backstays and at the chocks.

I use a leather product made by Edson that is used to protect turnbuckles and lines.

I secure them with several zip ties.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

https://edsonmarine.com/leather-turnbuckle-covers-large/

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of eric freedman
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 6:40 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Hi Brent,

Retrieving it really depends on the motion of the boat.

I had my bridles made with a large eye spliced into the end of each one. When I had Kimberlite built, I had Amel super reinforce the stern cleats. First tie a line on one if the bridles and when it becomes loose bring the line and bridle around the backstays and on to the other side of   the boat.

 

Then tie a big strong line to the eye that is still connected.

A few times the boat was rolling beam to beam. I just put a few turns of the added line around my primary winch and then when the boat rolled, I just pulled the line in and waited for Kimberlite to roll to the other side. On each roll I pulled in about 8 feet of line.

 

I forgot to mention that you have to make a rounded block of wood that will bolt through the stern cleat. Just anything that will prevent the drogue from getting stuck on the stern cleat and rip the parachutes.

It doesn’t have to be fancy.

 

Most of the time Kimberlite does not roll.

Again, bring one of the bridles over to the other side.

 

Now you will need 2 or 3 people for the next step.

If you have a third person, they will guide the drogue on board-nice touch but not imperative.

 

You will need 2 people on the primary winch. One to tail it by hand as the drogue lines are too thick for the

self-tailer . Secondly you must be careful not to rip the parachutes on the taling horn.

 

One person must press the winch switch while the other tails the line.

The winch is strong enough to bring in the drogue in 50 knots of wind.

 

However, if you try to continuously use the winch, it will overheat and shut off. You will then have to let the motor cool off for a few minutes before it resets and works.  My suggestion is to tail for a minute or so and then let it cool off for a minute or so.

That works best for me.

 

I have sailed single handed in 50 knots of wind from near Bermuda to New York.

However, that was silly of me. I should have put out the drogue.

That is where I now draw the line if I am expecting an extended blow.

 

Below is an article about us in a hurricane 36 hours – 60 foot seas wind 100 knots.

 

https://www.oceannavigator.com/prepare-for-survival-conditions/

 

Dave Pelissier of Ace sailmakers in Connecticut worked with Mr. Jordan and together they developed the drogue.
I would only get one from him if it is possible.

 

25 years ago, we were in near hurricane force winds . We were told by Herb Hilgenberg not to travel further North as the winds were horrific further North.

I was in my Tartan 37 at that time.

We were on the drogue overnight. The wind died down to 40 knots and my Tartan was literally rolling beam to beam on the drogue. I called Dave at Ace sailmakers and asked why this was happening, he didn’t know but he said call Mr. Jordan,  He gave me the number and I called him. I could hear by his voice he was quite old. After listening to me he said,  “ I know what the problem is – NOT ENOUGH WIND !!”

We brought in the drogue and sailed up to Bermuda.

 

Not Enough Wind- one of my favorite stories.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Brent Cameron via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 5:31 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

 

Brent Cameron, Future Amel owner & Amel Owner's Registry Moderator

On Apr 1, 2021, 4:51 PM -0400, eric freedman <kimberlite@...>, wrote:

Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf

 


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


Brent Cameron
 

AH….  Sorry, for some reason the groups.io locked me out saying my message bounced and I had to “unbounce it”..  I assumed that nobody got my first message and I didn’t get to see any subsequent replies until I unbounced it and so I sent my second copy in.  Now, that I see your reply to my second reply, I went on to the web and can see the messages that I wasn’t able to see while they locked my account (suspect it was because I recently changed my email from gmail to iCloud).  Anyway, it’s all good now.

Thanks for responding.  I remember seeing the wooden blocks on Kimberlite when we saw you in Bermuda in late 2019 and have read your account of the big storms many times but wasn’t sure how you brought it back in.  I hope that I never have to use one in anger but great to know how if I do!  Thanks again.  

 Brent

On Apr 1, 2021, 7:13 PM -0400, eric freedman <kimberlite@...>, wrote:

Hi Brent ,

Did you see the note I posted at 6:30 pm today?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Brent Cameron via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 7:00 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

 

Brent


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


Porter McRoberts
 

Eric, might you or anyone have a picture of the block over the chock?  I’m having a hard time imagining this!  

Much appreciated 
Porter

Porter McRoberts 
S/V IBIS A54-152
WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206
Www.fouribis.net

On Apr 1, 2021, at 1:25 PM, Brent Cameron via groups.io <brentcameron61@...> wrote:


AH….  Sorry, for some reason the groups.io locked me out saying my message bounced and I had to “unbounce it”..  I assumed that nobody got my first message and I didn’t get to see any subsequent replies until I unbounced it and so I sent my second copy in.  Now, that I see your reply to my second reply, I went on to the web and can see the messages that I wasn’t able to see while they locked my account (suspect it was because I recently changed my email from gmail to iCloud).  Anyway, it’s all good now.

Thanks for responding.  I remember seeing the wooden blocks on Kimberlite when we saw you in Bermuda in late 2019 and have read your account of the big storms many times but wasn’t sure how you brought it back in.  I hope that I never have to use one in anger but great to know how if I do!  Thanks again.  

 Brent
On Apr 1, 2021, 7:13 PM -0400, eric freedman <kimberlite@...>, wrote:

Hi Brent ,

Did you see the note I posted at 6:30 pm today?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Brent Cameron via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 7:00 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

 

Brent


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


Derick Gates
 

Eric, like Porter, I would like to see how you bolted the wooden blocks over the chocks. I assume you only do this prior to retrieving the Jordan drogue, and not prior to deployment?  The other picture I would like to see is how Amel super reinforced the stern cleats on Kimberlite.

I bought a Jordan drogue for BRAVA from Ace Sailmakers prior to my 2019 transAtlantic trip, and Dave P. convinced me to use dynema lines and the heavier cone material.  I am pleased with the quality job done by Ace Sailmakers. 

Thanks for all the great advice on deployment and retrieval. 

Derick

Derick Gates
S/V BRAVA SM2K #400


eric freedman
 

Sorry,

I am not on bard. I will be on board later next week. I will try to remember to take a few photos.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Porter McRoberts via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 8:27 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Eric, might you or anyone have a picture of the block over the chock?  I’m having a hard time imagining this!  

 

Much appreciated 

Porter

Porter McRoberts 

S/V IBIS A54-152

WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206



On Apr 1, 2021, at 1:25 PM, Brent Cameron via groups.io <brentcameron61@...> wrote:



AH….  Sorry, for some reason the groups.io locked me out saying my message bounced and I had to “unbounce it”..  I assumed that nobody got my first message and I didn’t get to see any subsequent replies until I unbounced it and so I sent my second copy in.  Now, that I see your reply to my second reply, I went on to the web and can see the messages that I wasn’t able to see while they locked my account (suspect it was because I recently changed my email from gmail to iCloud).  Anyway, it’s all good now.

Thanks for responding.  I remember seeing the wooden blocks on Kimberlite when we saw you in Bermuda in late 2019 and have read your account of the big storms many times but wasn’t sure how you brought it back in.  I hope that I never have to use one in anger but great to know how if I do!  Thanks again.  

 

 Brent

On Apr 1, 2021, 7:13 PM -0400, eric freedman <kimberlite@...>, wrote:

Hi Brent ,

Did you see the note I posted at 6:30 pm today?

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Brent Cameron via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 7:00 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

Great article Eric.  I know you’ve used yours in anger a few times.  I’m curious, what was the best way you’ve found to retrieve your JSD?

 

Brent


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


Brent Cameron
 

I looked to see if I took any pictures of those chocks as I remember looking at them (and wondering what they were) while onboard Kimberlite at the dock in Bermuda but I think that I was more interested in talking with Eric and his crew about the modifications he did for the JSD and their trip in from New York than taking pictures as I don’t see any in my photos bucket from that trip.    

Brent

--
Brent Cameron

Future Amel Owner & Amel Owner Registry Moderator

Oro-Medonte, Ontario, Canada


eric freedman
 

Hi,

I do not know how the cleats on your Amel are configured.

However, on the Amel Super Maramu the bridle of the drogue must go between the

the backstays. If you run them outside you will rip out the SSB antenna.

When the bridle is inside the backstays you cannot tighten one to change the direction of the boat

This  will deform the backstay. We just live with however the boat sits to the sea. We also add chafe gear to the bridle where it is near the backstays. We monitor the chafe gear every hour.

 

It is a bad idea to connect the bridle to the winches. They are not made to take a shock load and might be ripped out of the coaming. (That was a quote from Mr. Jordan)

 

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io On Behalf Of Porter McRoberts via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 6:27 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Jordan series drogue.

 

I also know you reinforced your rear cleats too. I don’t think we will do that. So considering a yoke between two either two cleats on each side or a cleat and the main winch for possible steering. Any thoughts on that?  Negatives or positives?  Who has thought this through and has a solution other than reinforcement of the rear cleat?  Or is that the only safe method?  

 

Many thanks

Porter McRoberts 

S/V IBIS A54-152

WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206



On Apr 1, 2021, at 12:23 PM, Porter McRoberts <portermcroberts@...> wrote:

Just saw that article from the OCC too. 

It is because if your experience and article Eric that we carry one. Thank you. 

Porter McRoberts 

S/V IBIS A54-152 Moorea

WhatsApp:+1 754 265 2206



On Apr 1, 2021, at 10:51 AM, eric freedman <kimberlite@...> wrote:



Some of you might know of my experiences with the Jordan Series Drogue.

It is a lifesaver and I thought you would find the article interesting.

I do not leave without it.

Fair Winds

Eric

Kimberlite Amel Super Maramu #376

 

 

 

https://liveicomgrshot.blob.core.windows.net/occfiles/Uploadedpdfs/20210328_JORDON%20SERIES%20DROGUE%20Best%20Practices%202.0.pdf