Topics

Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

Jeroen jeltes
 

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

Matt Salatino
 

The only way to prevent lightning damage to electronics is to be far away from a strike. You need to find a carrier that covers electronics. It’s a pricey fix! Ask Pantaenius again to rewrite your coverage to include electronics in case if lightning strike.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 4:41 AM, Jeroen jeltes <j.jeltes@...> wrote:

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

Courtney Gorman
 

When I first bought Trippin we had a near lightning strike not direct but close enough other boats in the Marina were affected Pantaenius US was my carrier and covered Most of the costs upward of $17,000 and were very easy to work with.
Cheers
Courtney
Trippin
54 #101
Secret Harbour Grenada 


-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt@...>
To: main <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Oct 7, 2019 8:24 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

The only way to prevent lightning damage to electronics is to be far away from a strike. You need to find a carrier that covers electronics. It’s a pricey fix! Ask Pantaenius again to rewrite your coverage to include electronics in case if lightning strike.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 4:41 AM, Jeroen jeltes <j.jeltes@...> wrote:

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

Beaute Olivier
 

Hello Jeroen,

there is not any good system to prevent the damages of a lightning strike. Even if the lightning strikes 100 m away form your vessel, the electronics could all be damaged through the electromagnetic field generated. This is  including alternators, battery chargers, washing machines, etc...
The purpose of the bonding system installed in the AMEL boats is to fight galvanic corrosion and/or detect a power leak able to create electrolytic corrosion. The main reason is that the wires used in this circuit are too small to stand any high power strike.


However there may be a way to "comply" with the insurers wish, and in order to show that you made the best you could to "drive" the lightning power to water. You should be be able to show your insurers (or the claim surveyor they commit) that you had such an equipment on board.
The equipment is a pair of copper cables, or stainless steel cables (standing rigging) 3m long each, with the same diameter as your top shrouds (12mm) or bigger, that you attach to the top shrouds on both sides thanks to a stainless steel cable clip when a thunderstorm comes or when you leave your vessel unattended in a marina (especially in the intertropical belt/convergence zone).
In order not to damage your hull, you will have these cables installed in rubber sleeves ( such as a water hose).

Again, this will definitely not protect the vessel against lightning strikes and consequences, but you'll be able to show something to your insurers.

Olivier

On Monday, October 7, 2019, 02:24:21 PM GMT+2, Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt@...> wrote:


The only way to prevent lightning damage to electronics is to be far away from a strike. You need to find a carrier that covers electronics. It’s a pricey fix! Ask Pantaenius again to rewrite your coverage to include electronics in case if lightning strike.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 4:41 AM, Jeroen jeltes <j.jeltes@...> wrote:

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

Matt Salatino
 

Courtney,
When did this happen.
I’m shopping for insurance for our new Amel, and was steered away from Pantaenius USA by many....
Thanks,

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 8:47 AM, Courtney Gorman via Groups.Io <Itsfun1@...> wrote:

When I first bought Trippin we had a near lightning strike not direct but close enough other boats in the Marina were affected Pantaenius US was my carrier and covered Most of the costs upward of $17,000 and were very easy to work with.
Cheers
Courtney
Trippin
54 #101
Secret Harbour Grenada 


-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt@...>
To: main <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Oct 7, 2019 8:24 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

The only way to prevent lightning damage to electronics is to be far away from a strike. You need to find a carrier that covers electronics. It’s a pricey fix! Ask Pantaenius again to rewrite your coverage to include electronics in case if lightning strike.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 4:41 AM, Jeroen jeltes <j.jeltes@...> wrote:

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

Courtney Gorman
 

Hi Matt
This was 2 years ago since then they have changed their restrictions in the Caribbean so much for hurricane protection that I have changed to Novamar
Cheers
Courtney
Trippin
54 #101
Secret Harbour Grenada


-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt@...>
To: main <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Oct 7, 2019 9:00 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

Courtney,
When did this happen.
I’m shopping for insurance for our new Amel, and was steered away from Pantaenius USA by many....
Thanks,

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 8:47 AM, Courtney Gorman via Groups.Io <Itsfun1@...> wrote:

When I first bought Trippin we had a near lightning strike not direct but close enough other boats in the Marina were affected Pantaenius US was my carrier and covered Most of the costs upward of $17,000 and were very easy to work with.
Cheers
Courtney
Trippin
54 #101
Secret Harbour Grenada 


-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt@...>
To: main <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Oct 7, 2019 8:24 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

The only way to prevent lightning damage to electronics is to be far away from a strike. You need to find a carrier that covers electronics. It’s a pricey fix! Ask Pantaenius again to rewrite your coverage to include electronics in case if lightning strike.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 4:41 AM, Jeroen jeltes <j.jeltes@...> wrote:

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

 

Jeroen,

Pantaenius has apparently inserted a clause that gives them complete wiggle room to not pay an electronics claim because they do not list a type of system, or approved systems. In fact, there are no systems that will always protect electronics from the electromagnetic surge caused by some lightning.  My guess is that even if you used what Olivier Beaute suggests, the insurance company can easily say that it was not adequate protection, because damage to onboard electronics occurred, and that is proof that your system was not adequate. Regarding Olivier Beaute, there is not a better surveyor in the world and I only recommend Olivier.

If it were me, I would ask Pantaenius if they approve the Forespar Lightning Master Static Dissipater (photo below), which you can buy for about 150€. If this is approved by them, please let us all know and install it for this reason: "You will have insurance when lightning strikes and damages your electronics." If they do not approve this Forespar item, ask them specifically what they approve. If you know a Catholic Priest, he will have a blessing to protect your boat from lightning strikes (Yes, they really do). And, lastly, between you and me, the priest's blessing will work slightly better than the Forespar Lightning Master Static Dissipater.
image.png

--
CW Bill Rouse Amel Yacht Owners School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
   


On Mon, Oct 7, 2019 at 8:43 AM Courtney Gorman via Groups.Io <Itsfun1=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Matt
This was 2 years ago since then they have changed their restrictions in the Caribbean so much for hurricane protection that I have changed to Novamar
Cheers
Courtney
Trippin
54 #101
Secret Harbour Grenada


-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt=yahoo.com@groups.io>
To: main <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Oct 7, 2019 9:00 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

Courtney,
When did this happen.
I’m shopping for insurance for our new Amel, and was steered away from Pantaenius USA by many....
Thanks,

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 8:47 AM, Courtney Gorman via Groups.Io <Itsfun1@...> wrote:

When I first bought Trippin we had a near lightning strike not direct but close enough other boats in the Marina were affected Pantaenius US was my carrier and covered Most of the costs upward of $17,000 and were very easy to work with.
Cheers
Courtney
Trippin
54 #101
Secret Harbour Grenada 


-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Salatino via Groups.Io <helmsmatt@...>
To: main <main@amelyachtowners.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Oct 7, 2019 8:24 am
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Lighting strike vs insurance [Amel Yacht Owners] Maramu - Main Mast Grounding / Bonding

The only way to prevent lightning damage to electronics is to be far away from a strike. You need to find a carrier that covers electronics. It’s a pricey fix! Ask Pantaenius again to rewrite your coverage to include electronics in case if lightning strike.

~~~⛵️~~~Matt

On Oct 7, 2019, at 4:41 AM, Jeroen jeltes <j.jeltes@...> wrote:

is this topic still active ?? Since this topic is several years past, and situations might have changed including insurance companies, i like to bring it up again .

Dear Olivier and Biil and all forum members. 

We are owner of Fidelis  A54 2009 and surveyed by Olivier in April 2018.

We recently changed insurance company because our previous insurers had no ocean going vessel experience.

Now we have Panteanius who seem to be professional and experienced and have some good recommendations,  yet..

On the policy( september 2019)  is a special reservation which excludes damage on electrical systems and navigatinal equipment caused by

lightningstrike , if there is no special system to prevent this damage !

The question is, would the existing bonding system be accepted te prevent damage  by lighting strike ?

Have yacht owners added new systems now insurance companies seem to reduce their risk ?

comment welcome.

Jeroen Jeltes

sv Fidelis A54

Scott SV Tengah
 

This is what Pants USA has in my policy from earlier this year:

"LIGHTNING DEDUCTIBLE

Notwithstanding and superseding any contrary terms or conditions contained anywhere in this policy, the following terms and conditions apply. The lightning deductible of 5% shall apply to any and all covered losses, including partial, total, and constructive total losses, caused directly or indirectly by lightning (“lightning-related loss”) while the insured vessel is in Florida waters from June 1st to November 30th. If it can be demonstrated
by the insured that a lightning protection system of like kind and quality to EMP Solutions Model CMCE-55 was fully functioning and properly installed on board the insured vessel at the time of loss, the lightning deductible stated above shall be reduced to the amount of the standard hull deductible stated on the Declaration Sheets. If the lightning-related loss occurs while the insured vessel is racing in Florida waters during the said time period, the applicable lightning deductible or the racing deductible stated in Section A5 of the PAYP, whichever is higher, shall apply. If the lightning-related loss occurs during authorized towing in Florida waters in the said time period, the applicable lightning deductible or the towing deductibles stated in Section A5 of the PAYP, whichever is higher, shall apply."

--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com

Jeroen jeltes
 

Thank you Olivier, Bill, and all ,  i will start a discussion with the Panteanius and will let you know the result. Jeroen.