Topics

SM2 Roller Reefer Guide Rods


David Kurtz
 

As I restepped my mast, I found that not one, but both of the guide rods on the top of the roller furler were bent like pretzels.  I am somewhat mystified as to what would create that amount of force at the top of the genoa.  I cannot recall any mishaps where the unfurling and furling of the genoa went poorly or I had difficulty.  Has anyone else experienced this or have an idea as to what might have caused this?  Obviously wish to avoid this in the future!

Thanks!
--
Dave Kurtz
SM2 #380
S/V Celtic Cross

Detroit, Michigan


 

It was caused by the swivel jamming. Now you'll need to determine why it jammed. 

Best,

CW Bill Rouse 
Amel Owners Yacht School
+1 832-380-4970 | brouse@...
720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
www.AmelOwnersYachtSchool.com 
Yacht School Calendar: www.preparetocastoff.blogspot.com/p/calendar.html


   

On Sat, Aug 29, 2020, 11:18 AM David Kurtz via groups.io <Davidwkurtz=me.com@groups.io> wrote:
As I restepped my mast, I found that not one, but both of the guide rods on the top of the roller furler were bent like pretzels.  I am somewhat mystified as to what would create that amount of force at the top of the genoa.  I cannot recall any mishaps where the unfurling and furling of the genoa went poorly or I had difficulty.  Has anyone else experienced this or have an idea as to what might have caused this?  Obviously wish to avoid this in the future!

Thanks!
--
Dave Kurtz
SM2 #380
S/V Celtic Cross

Detroit, Michigan


Craig Briggs
 

Hi Dave,

While it could be a jammed swivel, it is absolutely the classic pretzel you get by furling the genoa without removing the balooner halyard and its releasing "mouse" from the furling extrusion. I did it a few times early on when I would lower the balooner, forget all about the halyard and mouse still being in place while I bagged the sail. Then I'd furl in the Genoa. Oops, another pretzel! 

It's amazing how much torque the furler has. As I recall, I think I stopped doing that after three pretzels. And I tried to change procedures to remove the halyard/mouse immediately, although that's hard if you're doing it single handed. 

By the way, that will also really stress the rivets holding the furling extrusion onto the furler and there have been many posts here about those holes becoming enlarged and/or rivets breaking.

So, don't forget your mouse.

Cheers,
Craig,  -  SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Danny and Yvonne SIMMS
 

Hi all. A jammed swivel can cause the pretzles. Another method of forming them is to put yourcspar

On 30 August 2020 at 13:35 "Craig Briggs via groups.io" <sangaris@...> wrote:


Hi Dave,
PS to my earlier post.
Actually, as I think about it, I can't quite figure out how a "jammed swivel" would cause the "pretzels" of your anti-rotation rods.  A jammed swivel would perhaps cause the lower rivets to break, but it would not, kind of by definition, allow the upper swivel to rotate and bend over your anti-rotation bars that are now pretzels. Clearly either you or a prior owner has forgotten to lower and remove the balooner mouse and halyard before furling the genoa. Hence, the raised balooner halyard locks the ends of anti-rotation rods while the swivel turns freely with the full force of the motor and bends the rods into pretzels. 
Alternate interpretations welcomed, but this is how I see it.
--
Craig, SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Gary Wells
 

Happened to us early on as we didn't get the idea that the ballooner/spinnaker halyard has to remain quite tight and well out of the way (aft) of the spinning foil.  A halyard wrap into the genoa will cause the swivel and horns to rotate until you stop furling or the halyard parts.

In my case it was caused by an effort to tack the gennaker.  I figured since the gennaker had to be doused and cleared to the other side we  might as well use the genoa for a while to keep speed.  During the transition, when I was in fact holding on to the spinnaker halyard, it got wrapped up in the genoa as it was being furled and quite literally pulled me up and onto my feet.  Even stopping the furling immediately the horns we now pretzels.  Lesson learned; that spinnaker halyard must be kept tight and aft of the furler so it doesn't get caught in a wrap-up at the top.

sav@... has them in stock as far as I know, and if you choose to have a couple made up at a machine shop, it'll likely be just about the same price as ordering them. 

Almost lastly ... if the 'horns' are installed incorrectly, or if the swivel has lost its bearings or the "Crayon" inside, it can lead to scoring on the foil.  It could also lead to the horns catching onto one of the sail tracks and spinning with the foil.

Lastly, I douse that genoa and inspect and lube that swivel fairly often; two or three times a year.  :)

Hope that helps a little.

 

Gary W.
SM209, Adagio
Maryland, USA

 

 


David Kurtz
 

So... I returned to the boat to take a closer look at the roller furling swivel, which is down at deck level since the sail is not hoisted.  The swivel turns freely, with no sign of jamming.  And the ballooner has yet to be hoisted, so that’s not it.  I’m going to fabricate a couple of temporary guide rods (until I can get originals from Amel) and hoist the sail with those.  I still do not feel I have the answer to the bent rods.  I’m just going to watch them more closely.
--
Dave Kurtz
SM2 #380
S/V Celtic Cross

Detroit, Michigan


Craig Briggs
 

Hi Dave,
It sure quacks like the balooner halyard not being removed. Although you've not had the balooner up yourself, my guess is it was done by a prior owner and those were bent when you got the boat. How long have you had her?
Craig -- SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


 

David, don't forget, "before David."
CW Bill Rouse Amel Owners Yacht School
Address: 720 Winnie, Galveston Island, Texas 77550 
View My Training Calendar


On Sun, Aug 30, 2020 at 5:21 PM Craig Briggs via groups.io <sangaris=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Dave,
It sure quacks like the balooner halyard not being removed. Although you've not had the balooner up yourself, my guess is it was done by a prior owner and those were bent when you got the boat. How long have you had her?
Craig -- SN68 Sangaris, Tropic Isle Harbor, FL


Mike Ondra
 

Hi Dave,

True confession, I have twice furled the headsail with the ballooner halyard in place.  (I could say I was distracted by difficult “emergency” conditions, but that does not substitute for good seamanship.) Severed the halyard (that furling motor is powerful) AND bent over the guide rods. First time, utilizing some heat, simply bent them back straight. Second time, allowing for metal fatigue, decided to replace them. Picked up two 0.3125”x11” ss rods from OnlineMetals in CT for $2 ea ($7 shipping). Then threaded the end and used a pair of nuts and washers to secure to the swivel. Slipped some tubing over the exposed rod to soften the contact with the mast. Still works 4 years later.  

Mike

Aletes SM#240 Rock Hall, MD

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Kurtz via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2020 5:42 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] SM2 Roller Reefer Guide Rods

 

So... I returned to the boat to take a closer look at the roller furling swivel, which is down at deck level since the sail is not hoisted.  The swivel turns freely, with no sign of jamming.  And the ballooner has yet to be hoisted, so that’s not it.  I’m going to fabricate a couple of temporary guide rods (until I can get originals from Amel) and hoist the sail with those.  I still do not feel I have the answer to the bent rods.  I’m just going to watch them more closely.
--
Dave Kurtz
SM2 #380
S/V Celtic Cross

Detroit, Michigan