Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation


Arno Luijten
 

Hi Scott,

I'm not sure what boiler/water heater you have but our standard Isotemp is only 750Watt.

Also 4 Watt per day equals to 4 Ah @ 24 volt not 40 Ah. Still a significant draw though although I'm not sure if this includes the powering of the Masterbus itself.

Regards,

Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Mohammad Shirloo
 

Thanks Scott for the very useful information that has functioned well for 18 months. If you don’t mind, I may reach out to you when we get closer to our final design concept and pick you brains and integrate your experience into our design.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott SV Tengah via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2020 12:29 PM
To: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation

 

Hey everyone,

We've lived 18 months in mostly tropical conditions with the Quattro 5kw. I have some thoughts on this.

1) You can mount the Quattro 5kw in the engine room, VERTICALLY as Victron intended. We had to mount the secondary Skylla-i 80amp charger horizontally, but that's fine as it will never run for more than 2 hours at a time, even if my 450ah lithium bank is completely empty (which it has never been). Both are placed right where Amel put my original Dolphin 100a and 30a chargers, making installation easy.
See installation photo on my earlier post at https://amelyachtowners.groups.io/g/main/message/47890

I have obsessively monitored charging and inverter output via the VE-Config software and the BMV-712 battery monitor because of heat concerns and possible power tapering. In my 18 months of mostly tropical live board living, that has never happened. Inverter output has never been tapered, even when motoring and running a big inverter load. Charger output has also never been tapered on either the Quattro or the Skylla, even when both are running off genset.

Lior - that said, you will need to break out the seal between the passageway and the engine room to install new cables. Don't skimp on this. This is not difficult and resealing it is not difficult either.

FYI installing the Quattro 3kw will still require that you use 2 PAIRS of 50mm2 cables, per Victron. 

2) We opted for 5kw because the admiral and crew don't always monitor their concurrent usage. If they're running the boiler (2kw), the washing machine is in heat mode (1.5kw) and someone turns on the microwave (1kw), we are quite happy to have the Quattro 5kw. This isn't often, but it has happened before. Also the surge capacity of the Quattro 5kw allows us to use the scuba compressor on inverter/battery.

3) We looked at the Mastervolt Ultra. It draws 4w when the inverter is off. It draws 7w when the "low power mode" is selected. The MV low power mode is the same functionality as the "search mode" on the Victron, with the same no-load draw. What it does is pulse the inverter on every few seconds to search for a load. I opted not to do this because it causes my analog voltage meter (in the cabinet above the galley sink) to jump back and forth. Perhaps this is fine, but I didn't want the additional mechanical wear and the clicking sound is a bit annoying. And it won't turn sense low draw loads like small AC chargers or possibly laptops.

Instead, I installed a simple $5 switch on the electrical panel which allowed me to turn on/off the inverter remotely. We turn it on when we need the big inverter and turn it off most of the time. When "off", the power consumption is zero, which is less than the Mastervolt. That saves me 40AH a day, which is the equivalent of the daily output of a 200w solar panel!
https://amelyachtowners.groups.io/g/main/message/50689

We have the Amel installed 800w Mastervolt inverter at the nav station. We use that when we're running laptops, ice maker, bread maker, projector, cordless drill AC chargers, etc. Because of its low capacity, it's far more efficient at low power draws. We also changed some jumpers to activate "Economic Mode" so it draws even less when power draw is <250w.

Hope this helps.

--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Scott SV Tengah
 

Arno,

Sorry, I should have been more clear.

By boiler, I mean electric kettle. When the admiral is in the galley, appliances come on concurrently a lot.

Secondly, for my Victron Quattro 5kw, the measured idle draw when the inverter is on is 40watts. That's 40Ah per day.
Victron says 25w idle draw with inverter on, but my guess is that some of the AC items plugged into the AC sockets are drawing a decent amount, even when "idle".

The 4w you mentioned is for the Mastervolt Ultra with the inverter OFF. Note that the Quattro, with inverter OFF( via a $5 switch), draws zero watts.
--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Scott SV Tengah
 

Mohammad, happy to help. 

Might I suggest asking the question on the forum, so that others may also learn from my experiences and not make the same mistakes I did.

--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Scott SV Tengah
 

Hmm, are you suggesting that the 95mm2 cables go from that engine room junction to the batteries directly? Take a look behind your battery main switches and see if there's a pair of 95mm2 cables running towards the engine room.

I recall when replacing my Dolphin 100a and 30a, there were separate wires behind the main switches, by the batteries, that were labelled 100a and 30a. That implies that the wires for each charger went directly to the batteries vs. through that "junction" in the engine room. Note we re-used the 100a cables for our Skylla-i 80a. And as noted, we installed two pairs of 50mm2 for the new Quattro 5kw/120a. The wire sizing was for the inverter portion (5000/26.3 = 190+ amps).

--
Scott 
2007 A54 #69
SV Tengah
http://www.svtengah.com


Arno Luijten
 

Hi Scott,

On my A54 the cables for the chargers (Mastervolt 100 A and 40 A) are routed individually to the batteries. They are actually connected on the primary side of the big red switches (so connected to the battery side). Pretty sure they did this to make sure the charger "knows" the exact battery voltage and to enable charging with the red switches off (when the boat is decommissioned for example) . The junction in the engine room is only supplying the gray fuse box as far as I can see. This is also where the inverter gets it power from (via a circuit breaker). I did not investigate where this 95mm2 feed cable is exactly going to. That is not so easy, hence my question on this forum. At the back of the red switches there is a plethora of cables going in all directions, the markings are not easy to read. There are also two studs distributing the power as well.

Regards,
Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Sv Garulfo
 



Mohammad, Arno,

In the message 

I described the implementation of the MasterVolt MassCombi Pro 24V/3500W/100A on Garulfo (amongst other things)

Hope it helps,

Mohammad, 
Note that we have a dessalator duo100 (24V and 220V), so we can run it directly on the batteries. The overall unit is about 900W, so we could also use the 220V side through the inverter, say if the 24V side was faulty and didn’t want to run the genset. If your watermater 150L/h is 220V only and uses 3kW, you’ll need to take that into consideration for your inverter choice. 


Best,

Thomas
GARULFO 
A54-122
Tahuata, French Polynesia 




On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 13:14, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote:
Hi Scott,

On my A54 the cables for the chargers (Mastervolt 100 A and 40 A) are routed individually to the batteries. They are actually connected on the primary side of the big red switches (so connected to the battery side). Pretty sure they did this to make sure the charger "knows" the exact battery voltage and to enable charging with the red switches off (when the boat is decommissioned for example) . The junction in the engine room is only supplying the gray fuse box as far as I can see. This is also where the inverter gets it power from (via a circuit breaker). I did not investigate where this 95mm2 feed cable is exactly going to. That is not so easy, hence my question on this forum. At the back of the red switches there is a plethora of cables going in all directions, the markings are not easy to read. There are also two studs distributing the power as well.

Regards,
Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Mohammad Shirloo
 

Thank you Thomas. I’ll review and am sure will have some questions.

 

Happy Sailing;

 

 

Mohammad and Aty

B&B Kokomo

AMEL 54 #099

 

From: main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io <main@AmelYachtOwners.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sv Garulfo via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2020 4:17 PM
To: main@amelyachtowners.groups.io
Subject: Re: [AmelYachtOwners] Victron Quattro charger/inverter installation

 

 

 

Mohammad, Arno,

 

In the message 

 

I described the implementation of the MasterVolt MassCombi Pro 24V/3500W/100A on Garulfo (amongst other things)

 

Hope it helps,

 

Mohammad, 

Note that we have a dessalator duo100 (24V and 220V), so we can run it directly on the batteries. The overall unit is about 900W, so we could also use the 220V side through the inverter, say if the 24V side was faulty and didn’t want to run the genset. If your watermater 150L/h is 220V only and uses 3kW, you’ll need to take that into consideration for your inverter choice. 

 

 

Best,

 

Thomas

GARULFO 

A54-122

Tahuata, French Polynesia 

 

 

 

 

On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 13:14, Arno Luijten <arno.luijten@...> wrote:

Hi Scott,

On my A54 the cables for the chargers (Mastervolt 100 A and 40 A) are routed individually to the batteries. They are actually connected on the primary side of the big red switches (so connected to the battery side). Pretty sure they did this to make sure the charger "knows" the exact battery voltage and to enable charging with the red switches off (when the boat is decommissioned for example) . The junction in the engine room is only supplying the gray fuse box as far as I can see. This is also where the inverter gets it power from (via a circuit breaker). I did not investigate where this 95mm2 feed cable is exactly going to. That is not so easy, hence my question on this forum. At the back of the red switches there is a plethora of cables going in all directions, the markings are not easy to read. There are also two studs distributing the power as well.

Regards,
Arno Luijten
SV Luna,
A54-121


Jose Venegas
 

Hi James, 
Great to know you are in Cartagena.  We are in Curazao waiting for the port of Cartagena to open, which theoretically will be next week but it has been delayed several times.   I decided to buy a 5 kW inverter and install it outside of the engine compartment.  See https://amelyachtowners.groups.io/g/main/message/55033.  It made it much to deal with the 60 50 Hz issue to buy a new charger and rewire it using the connections of the old 30 a battery charger.   
Also, while doing the work within the engine compartment, I wired a double fan to blow into the engine compartment that kept me less hot while I was doing the work in the engine room.  Mounting an inverter-charger in the engine room requires to pass very large cables from the engine compartment to the battery box.  (The Victron Phenix inverter required 2 1/0 gauge cables for each positive and negative poles.  Mounting the inverter near the batteries avoids the problem and you only need to pass the 220V 20 amp 3 wires cable, not an easy task but much easier than passing the 4 DC cables.

Hope to see you soon,

Jose Venegas
Ipanema SM2K 278
Curazao

Hope to see you soon.

Jose